Viewing Single Post From: Stiff and Hakado vs Inui and Omni

Viewing Single Post From: Stiff and Hakado vs Inui and Omni
+Ema Skye	Feb 15 2008, 12:25 AM
Snackoos = <3. It's science! Posts: 20,967 Group: Advisor Member #40 Joined: June 9, 2005	Quote: Mmkay. Mia is better-endowed, is cuter, doesn’t have as much of a cliché personality, etc., etc. Wrong. Micaiah is MUCH more attractive than Mia is. Let’s compare their looks. Yeah, Micaiah definitely wins. She’s got sexy legs and doesn’t have a tiny chest, unlike Mia. Mia also has a VERY annoying voice in FE10 and since supports are two lines now, she barely has any character. Mia has a grand total of one information conversation where she challenges Ike because she lost to him the last time she challenged him. Micaiah on the other hand actually HAS a personality and appears in tons of information conversations. Quote: No point in wasting time. Let’s start with a direct comparison, in Part 4. Or not, because it's retarded to base the entire debate on that and discard the rest of the game for no reason. Micaiah exists a lot more than Mia during said rest of the game, which is probably why you're so eager to rush to the end. Quote: For levels...20/1 is the best Micaiah can do by the end of Part One (that’s being generous to her, even). Then she has 3-6, 3-7, 3-12, and 3-13. Four chapters. Due to her rather poor durability, she’s often avoiding combat, so she gains less EXP than your other combat units; of course, she does have Staves to compensate, so it’s about the same overall. ~2 levels per chapter = 8 levels altogether, making her 20/9. We’ll be nice and say 20/11 Wow, are you serious? I think you’re completely ignoring the fact that Micaiah has this wonderful thing called range as well as an A support with Sothe. Her support with Sothe gives them both, +7.5 accuracy, +15 dodge, and +2 damage. 15 dodge is how much 7.5 points of Speed gives, which is a good amount. Also, she has an 80% luck growth rate and 10 base Luck, so her dodge really isn’t that bad. She also has a Bond with Sothe which gives +5 critical and +5 crit evd. That’s +15 dodge, +5 critical, +8 accuracy, +5 crit evd, and +2 damage, all of which takes no time to build and makes both Sothe and Micaiah more durable and damaging. Sothe also happens to have Guard, a skill that redirects attacks to him from Micaiah if she’s next to him. Yeah, it doesn’t always work but it sure as hell helps a lot. Saying Micaiah has poor durability is a joke. Not to mention that Micaiah can hit enemies from a range, which makes her durability rarely matter in the first place. As for experience, she’s the only non-prepromote and non-laguz unit in Part 1 who can use the Paragon scroll you get on 1-6-2. Therefore, it’s not generous at all getting her to 20/1 because if you’re having any problems you can give her that Paragon for a chapter and you’re fine, even though you’ll be fine without it. Quote: Mia, on the other hand, starts at 20/7 in 3-P. 3-1, 3-2, 3-3, 3-4, 3-5, 3-8, 3-10, 3-11, and 3-F are also all chapters in which she can participate. At a rate of 2 levels per chapter (it’s even higher in later chapters), she’s 20/20/6 by Part 4. Then subtract for her naturally high initial level, and that’s about 20/20/3. Further subtract just to be as mean as possible to Mia and as nice as possible to Micaiah, and you’re left at 20/20/1. So, at the very best, it’s 20/11 vs. 20/20/1. It can’t get any better than that for Micaiah, so if Mia wins in this case, she wins in all possible (reasonable) cases. At those levels... Mia: 25.2 Might, 32.0 Speed, 86.5 Hit, 36 Critical 86.5 Evade, 21.6 Defense, 15.2 Resistance, 44.0 HP Micaiah: 28.8 Might, 18.1 Speed, 73.8 Hit, 10 Critical 69.4 Evade, 10.8 Defense, 29.5 Resistance, 28.6 HP Defense is a clear victory for Mia. 11 Def, 11-12 HP, and 17 Avoid >>> 14 Res, quite easily. Even against magical enemies, Mia can vie with Micaiah with her huge HP and Eva leads, whereas the same can never be said of Micaiah against physical enemies. At best Micaiah’s better Eva from supports can let her win against Magic (which is actually an overstatement, since the gap only decreases by ~7, lol), but Mia wins against everything else easily no matter what, so it’s no contest at all. If you’re going to use numbers, use the RIGHT numbers. If she’s standing near Sothe she has 84.4 Evd. I’d say that’s pretty bad if Mia only has 12.1 more evade than Micaiah does when she’s 10 levels and a whole tier higher than Micaiah. Micaiah also has +8 accuracy from Sothe and is also going to be given Tauroneo’s Resolve in part 1 because he’s durable enough to be fine without it, so in the event she gets hit she has h4x evade and doesn’t get double attacked. Her durability is fine, especially if she’s standing next to Sothe, who promotes at the end of 4-P. Quote: Offense is also clearly Mia’s. Micaiah’s AS is atrocious—even one of the slowest enemies at this point, Generals, have around 17-18 AS, and Micaiah can only double things with 14 Spd or less (even with BEXP, she wouldn’t get the Generals, so meh). Mia, meanwhile, can double everything comfortably, including bosses and Swordmasters. I don’t have to tell you how important doubling is, especially in this game, where not many people are doing it. Not doubling even Generals = phail offense. Mia also has a lot more Hit and Crit. facepalm Micaiah OHKOs Generals with Thani, it DOESN’T MATTER that she can’t double them. Also, it’s too bad that Micaiah does way more damage since magic targets Resistance and OHKOs basically every armor and mounted unit. Even if Micaiah doesn’t kill a physical enemy, she isn’t going to be counterattacked, whereas Mia will be. So even if Mia does a bit more damage because she doubles, she also might get hit and is awful against Generals with her puny might. Quote: Micaiah has 3 more Atk, but Swords >>> Light in damage. Iron Sword has 3 more Mt. than Light, so at the worst they’re about even there, but they’re almost never going to use basic weapons at this point—take Ellight, for example, which has 5 Mt. compared to Steel Sword’s 9, giving Mia a 2-Atk lead, and Shine has 7 compared to Silver Sword’s 12, giving her a 3-Atk lead. Then, above Shine, Micaiah has little option, whereas Mia can go up as far as Silver Blade, giving her a tremendous 6-point Atk lead, lolpwned. Too bad Micaiah isn’t going to be using Light and Ellight, she’s going to be using Thani. That’s 1 less might than a Steel Sword and 4 less than a Silver Sword. Swords have to be purchased and are expensive, whereas Thani is free. Thani attacks Resistance while Mia attacks Defense. If Mia has 25.2 might and Micaiah has 28.8 might, then Mia requires a Silver Sword to have a measly 0.4 might lead and hits Resistance instead of Defense. Mia got lolpwned indeed. Quote: All that Micaiah has is attacking Res, but in a lot of cases that only cancels out (and sometimes fails even to do that) Mia’s general Atk lead. Halberdiers and Swordmasters, for example, only have 3-4 Def-Res gaps on average. Then, in other cases, like if there’s a magical enemy involved, it’s actually bad for Micaiah to attack Res. Micaiah can never one-round a magic user, no matter what level she is or what weapons she wields—not only can she not double them, but even if she could double, she can’t do enough damage to one-round them. Often even a Crit won’t do it. All that Micaiah really has going for her offensively is moar damage per blow against high-Def enemies (Thani is included in this). Mia’s AS, Hit, and Crit leads >>>>> that. As previously mentioned, Mia’s “general atk lead” does not exist. While Mia does double, she still doesn’t do remarkable damage and does absolute garbage damage against Generals. Micaiah does more damage per blow against [insert unit here] unless they can use magic. All Mia has is more damage against weaker enemies because she doubles and magic users. There are plenty of h4x units that can do that better than Mia. Quote: But the advantages don’t stop there. Mia also has 1 more Move than Micaiah, and this most definitely matters since FE10 has large amounts of terrain and people with Move Again; even Micaiah’s 1-2 Range won’t save her in this area, since it doesn’t affect position at all on Enemy Phase. After Spd (which Micaiah also doesn’t have, btw), Move is possibly the most important stat in this game, and Micaiah’s below the average in it. Then Mia has Astra, which essentially increases her Crit lead, and more worthwile characters with which to build supports (the likes of Volug and Fiona as gamewide characters? no way). lolGreilMercs. Finally, Mia isn’t restricted to going to a specific set of 2 chapters in Part Four—she can go with any army that she wants, and that flexibility = w1n. It doesn’t matter if position doesn’t get affected by Micaiah’s 1-2 range. Unless you’re an idiot, you’re going to put good tank units in front so that they can’t reach Micaiah or your other units in the back. Yes, for 2 chapters Mia has Astra but wtf is this “more worthwhile(you spelled it wrong btw) characters with which to build supports”? Micaiah starts with an A support with Sothe, you don’t get much more worthwhile than that and doesn’t have to waste any time to build that. Mia on the other hand will probably get Nephenee, who is a good unit among better units. Also, Mia IS restricted to going to a specific set of 2 chapters in part four. Mia is worthless on Micaiah’s route because of the desert, and she’s worthless in Tibarn’s route because of the swamp and the forest chapter has parts that restrict movement too. The one route she’s forced on has a fog of war chapter. So much for flexibility. Quote: To compete, Micaiah has...healing, which she’s massively restricted in due to poor physical durability? zomg, phail. ggnore. Mia wins easily. It doesn’t get any better after Micaiah promotes, either. Mia has a big level lead still and continues to win durability by quite a bit. The Final is full of ranged enemies, so that makes Micaiah's bad durability even more noticeable (having not only to stay a space back from the frontlines, but a space back even from that? lolwth). Her AS problem also continues to hamper her offense almost completely, whereas Mia has quite the opposite trait offensively. Micaiah prior to promotion has Sacrifice to heal and you can heal her with Laura to put her back to full health and give them both experience. After promoting to tier 2, she has staves, and she can stay safely behind units or next to Sothe so she doesn’t take damage. You can steal a few Physic Staves in this game, and you can buy them unlimitedly in Final Chapter so she can heal from almost anywhere on the map. Once you can bless Purge, she has infinite uses for a weapon and she can attack from far away enough to not get damaged. Not to mention that there are plenty of godly units and there’s a good chance that you may not even be bringing Mia into the final chapter. Quote: You’re probably going to argue Part One utility, but that’s barely existent for Micaiah. She has passable offense thanks to Thani, but her defense is among the worst on your whole team (only Laura is worse, and maybe Fiona if untrained, but that’s it), so that means she’s practically worthless on Enemy Phase, making her use in Part One extraordinarily meh (almost Leonardo-level). As for Sacrifice, lol—it can’t replace Laura, and so it doesn’t matter at all. To use it, Micaiah has to damage her own health, which means that, to use it a second time after that, she has to be healed (not because of bad durability, which is indeed true as well, but also because she can’t heal for much HP after using it once). If she uses a Vulnerary to heal herself, someone’s not getting healed that turn, so that’s phail. If she doesn’t, that means Laura has to heal Micaiah so that Micaiah can heal someone else—wut. That’s more inefficient than just using Laura herself directly, moar phail. You must have never played Fire Emblem: Radiant Dawn if you think Micaiah's not awesome in Part 1. Passable offense? No, it's actually the best offense against a large number of enemies. Every single mounted and armoured foe is OHKO'd without fail by Micaiah, which is absolutely amazing since even Nolan, Sothe, and Zihark struggle to kill those enemies. Calling this "passable" must be some sort of joke. She can even OHKO several bosses in Part 1. Then against everything else, her gigantic Mag(7 base with 80% growth ftw) lets her do huge damage regardless. In addition to Thani being pwnage as a weapon, it has absolutely no value, meaning when Micaiah attacks she's almost always costing nothing. That's a pretty good benefit since money can be kinda gay in this game. Mia, however, uses a very expensive weapon type and likes to use good weapons to make up for her meh Str and use her Crit well. She costs way more than Micaiah. Replacing Laura isn't the point of Sacrifice. Sacrifice can be used just to gain EXP, meaning Micaiah takes less EXP from the team. Oh, someone has 1 HP to heal due to leveling up? Use Sacrifice for free EXP. Micaiah can't attack, but she can use Sacrifice to heal someone in danger? Sure, do that, and then have Laura heal Micaiah so they both get to gain EXP. It's a win for everyone. In addition to pooling EXP from healing even before promotion, she costs 200 less EXP and/or 2 less Crowns than anyone else, which means she's consuming less in resources by even more. Less money and less EXP. Nice. Quote: Then, for Part Three...Mia is pretty h4x for a while due to actually working Avoid and huge Spd, letting her double even the uberfast units (which tend to be the more threatening ones, such as SMs), and Mia gets more chapters than Micaiah here. Micaiah, meanwhile, finally has some usage due to Staves, but in one of her chapters she’s restricted to a platform far away from the action, and in other chapters she’s facing Laguz that can one-round her, so even that’s not overly impressive, if impressive at all. I’d say that Mia is winning Part Three, actually, but it doesn’t really matter much in the face of the rest. Mia's not "h4x" at all when compared to the juggernauts she's with. Titania, Ike, Shinon, and Gatrie all dwarf her. Shortly after that, Haar joins, making her get dwarfed even more. Evd is nice, but it's not reliable at all when you have a single weapon and biorhythm likes to be random and fuck you up. Quote: To compete, Micaiah has...healing, which she’s massively restricted in due to poor physical durability? zomg, phail. ggnore. Mia wins easily. It doesn’t get any better after Micaiah promotes, either. Mia has a big level lead still and continues to win durability by quite a bit. The Final is full of ranged enemies, so that makes Micaiah's bad durability even more noticeable (having not only to stay a space back from the frontlines, but a space back even from that? lolwth). Her AS problem also continues to hamper her offense almost completely, whereas Mia has quite the opposite trait offensively. What does Micaiah's durability have anything to do with her healing? She doesn't need to be in attack ranges of the enemies to heal since you have lots of units for blockading, and lots of chokepoints, and you can check enemy range just be clicking on them. Micaiah increases the entire team's durability by healing people, and then she's giving +15 Evd to Sothe to make him a tank. The final being full of ranged enemies is only a benefit for Micaiah. Micaiah has good 1~2 range, so enemies don't like attacking her over Mia who has either no 1~2 range or bad and/or expensive 1~2 range. The magic enemies also cling Micaiah, so they hate attacking her. Like a lot of units, Micaiah does not double. This isn't a massive handicap for her. She has Thani to instant-kill almost every armour and mount in the entire game, and then healing to increase the team's durability and not take EXP from them in the process. ((This post has done by both of us if you can't tell.))
	MUNCH MUNCH MUNCH MUNCH MUNCH MUNCH MUNCH

Stiff and Hakado vs Inui and Omni · Debates