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| Roma Imperium; Empire or Republic? | |
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| Topic Started: Jun 16 2005, 08:05 PM (198 Views) | |
| Hound of Cullann | Jun 16 2005, 08:05 PM Post #1 |
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A more unusual debate topic. Know that you really don't need to know that much about Roman history to post in this. Alright, so, if you know about the Roman Empire, you'll know that during the time of Gaius Julius Caesar (80-50 BCE), there was serious political and military change. With Gaius Marius creating the famous Roman "Legionaric Cohort/Manipalos", with Lucinnius Crassus killing Spartacus on Vesuvius, and Caesar's new Roman Government proposition. Caesar sought to make Rome an Imperial State, from it's Republic state, which was ruled by Senators. He was killed, so his son Octavianus Julius carried out his father's dream, becoming Emperor Augusts. So, do you think that Rome, mainly the Western Roman Empire, would have lasted longer under the Senatorial Republic? Or the long line of Emperors it took under the Imperium? For me, I'd have to say the Republic. By 500 CE, Rome was ruled by 500 families connected to the Emperor, and was bound to fall (Which is why Byzantine OMGWTFPWNED Rome in life span). The Republic for the first 500 years of Rome, was hardly ever corrupt, managed to defeat every single enemy. (After all, during the Republic, Rome crushed the Germans. During the Empire, they could never even put up a fight). |
 
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| +Santi | Jun 16 2005, 08:12 PM Post #2 |
Da Niggaz Leader
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i'd say a republic based on the facts. Am I the only that's reminded of Star Wars when I read this? |
   
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| Hound of Cullann | Jun 16 2005, 08:14 PM Post #3 |
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Star Wars is kind of based of the Roman Empire, in many ways. Why do you think Octavius had the Senatus Praetorians assassinated before he took up the throne? =P Like Palpatine unto the Jedi. (Edit: I don't use Octavianus because that was not his name until he became Emperor) |
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| +Santi | Jun 16 2005, 08:16 PM Post #4 |
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Da Niggaz Leader
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True...I like reading more about Roman warfare, tohugh. That's more interesting to me. |
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| Yes | Jun 16 2005, 08:37 PM Post #5 |
The Real OG
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BRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR!!!! English please? |
 I'm the Juggernaut Bitch!!! | |
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| Hound of Cullann | Jun 16 2005, 08:57 PM Post #6 |
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Roman Lifetime: 280 BCE - 480 CE (600 Years) (Average Life of Western Roman Empire) Wars Won During the Time of the Senate: The 3 Wars against Carthage (Punic Wars) Iberian War Gallic War Macedonian War Greco-Macedonian War Seleuka War Egyptian War Pontic War Armenian/Parthian War Numidian War Dacian War ^ Wars Lost: German Tribal Wars Thracian War (Though viewed as a victory, it was actually a loss due to a Getaen Uprising) Wars Won During Time of the Empire: The Gladiator Uprising of Spartacus Romano-Frank War Civil War - Gnaeus Pompei vs. Julius Caeser Civil War - Gaius Marius vs. Gnaeus Pompei ^ Wars Lost Parthian Wars Hunic Wars Sarmatian Wars Bulgarian Wars Ottoman War (Though, this is more of Byzantine, but is still considered the war that killed the last true Romans) Sassanid War Officals ordered to be executed during Republic: (Yearly) 5 Officals ordered to be executed during Empire: (Yearly) 5,000 Basically, compare the two. |
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| +Santi | Jun 16 2005, 10:58 PM Post #7 |
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Da Niggaz Leader
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I hope to God that you looked all that up. If you got that from your memory.... |
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| Hound of Cullann | Jun 16 2005, 11:01 PM Post #8 |
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When you've studied Roman and Byzantine as long as I have, it comes naturally. I looked at about 2 books when I put that stuff down, as well as infallibe facts from memory. |
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| Sentenal (OLD) | Jun 16 2005, 11:57 PM Post #9 |
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Mr. Manly American Republican
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The Byzantine Empire was just as much an Empire as the Western Empire was, and it lasted an addtional 1,000 years after Rome's fall. I say its much more effective to be a military power as an empire than a Republic. The fountation of Rome was established when it was a Republic, so of course the Republic won more wars. Rome was in it's prime as an empire. From a domestic view, Republic is better. I think the facts show that. I don't really know which one would have defininativly lasted longer, but I'll go with empire. |
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| Cyrus | Jun 17 2005, 10:16 AM Post #10 |
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Wasn't Octavian known as Augustus when he took up the throne? Or was that later on? |
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| Hound of Cullann | Jun 17 2005, 10:58 AM Post #11 |
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He Political Title was Augustus, by his birth name was changed to Octavianus (The suffix 'us' is one of rank). |
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| FireEmblemgirl | Jun 17 2005, 02:38 PM Post #12 |
I never took the time to take the arrows out of my back
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I have to agree with ya'll. I think the republic would have lasted longer. Since everyone played to please the Senate in order to gain power there was a set order of things. With an empire, the emperor doesn't need to please anybody but himself. The Senate also gave a diversity of rulers which made Rome the melting pot it was. With an emperor that might not be open to new ideas Rome could easily collapse in on itself the way Eygpt did. |
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Not Waving but Drowning Nobody heard him, the dead man, But still he lay moaning: I was much further out than you thought And not waving but drowning. Poor chap, he always loved larking And now he's dead It must have been too cold for him his heart gave way, They said. Oh, no no no, it was too cold always (Still the dead one lay moaning) I was much too far out all my life And not waving but drowning. -Stevie Smith | |
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| Sentenal (OLD) | Jun 17 2005, 03:25 PM Post #13 |
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Mr. Manly American Republican
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History has shown the Democracies have a VERY hard time lasting the stand of time (in fact, none have). I'm not sure if thats the same with Republics, but I'd bet they have the same success rating. Lets hope the US is able to boost the Republic's success rates (as the US is a republic). |
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| FireEmblemgirl | Jun 18 2005, 01:10 PM Post #14 |
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I never took the time to take the arrows out of my back
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Democracies are the hardest forms of government. It makes controlling the people hard. The U.S. is such a good form of democracy because we had such brilliant people set it up. But democracies have lasted a good long time. For example Athens outlasted Sparta which was ruled by an king or emperor. Despite the fact I like Sparta better, Athens outlasted them because of their strong democracy that gave many intelligent minds a say in the government. |
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Not Waving but Drowning Nobody heard him, the dead man, But still he lay moaning: I was much further out than you thought And not waving but drowning. Poor chap, he always loved larking And now he's dead It must have been too cold for him his heart gave way, They said. Oh, no no no, it was too cold always (Still the dead one lay moaning) I was much too far out all my life And not waving but drowning. -Stevie Smith | |
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| +Santi | Jun 18 2005, 01:18 PM Post #15 |
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Da Niggaz Leader
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True; Sparta had a better army, but Athens had a bteer government. I say communism always fails, though. In theory, it's the best form of goverment. But there will always be people who cheat that system. |
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