Jeigan vs Othin

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Jeigan vs Othin
Topic Started: Sep 11 2007, 11:28 PM (304 Views)
+Ema Skye	Sep 11 2007, 11:28 PM Post #1
Snackoos = <3. It's science! Posts: 20,938 Group: Advisor Member #40 Joined: June 9, 2005	lol good luck othin
	MUNCH MUNCH MUNCH MUNCH MUNCH MUNCH MUNCH


Big Boss	Sep 12 2007, 10:02 PM Post #2
Posts: 650 Group: FEFFer Member #890 Joined: August 19, 2006	soez, you switched to Alec, I switched to Cuan. Let's see wut happens. In dis game, being prepromoted is a good thing. Your unit starts strong and has the same amount of levels to gain. This is the case of Cuan, who joins 2 turns after Alec. Cuan Lv4. 34 HP, 16 Str, 10 Skl, 10 Spd, 10 Def, 3 Res, 5 Lck Alec Lv2. 32 HP, 9 Str, 9 Skl, 10 Spd, 7 Def, 0 Res, 4 Lck Rape. Alec has pursuit, but Cuan still deals moar damage. Furthermore, Cuan is already in love with Ethlin. When they are near each other, they receive 10% bonus in Hit and avoid. Cuan clearly wins here, and this is pretty much the same situation in chapters 1 and 2. By chapter 3, when Alec promotes and he may have a chance to compete, Cuan gets the Gae Bolg for massive rape. Being good during 4 chapters>>>>Being mediocre during 6 chapters. As for events, in chapter one Cuan talks to Finn, giving him +1 in Str, Skl and Def. In chapter 2, Finn receives the Hero lance from Cuan. Being a very nice help for the unit who's in your party during both generations=h4x. Cuan is better in combat and benefits people. Cuan>Alec
	^^by comatose from NationalSigLeague^^ Kratos/Jeigan


Barst	Sep 15 2007, 08:45 PM Post #3
Like I said before... I am perfect. Posts: 1,100 Group: FEFFer Member #1,241 Joined: May 5, 2007	Jiegan In dis game, being prepromoted is a good thing. Your unit starts strong and has the same amount of levels to gain. This is the case of Cuan, who joins 2 turns after Alec. Cuan Lv4. 34 HP, 16 Str, 10 Skl, 10 Spd, 10 Def, 3 Res, 5 Lck Alec Lv2. 32 HP, 9 Str, 9 Skl, 10 Spd, 7 Def, 0 Res, 4 Lck Rape. Alec has pursuit, but Cuan still deals moar damage. Furthermore, Cuan is already in love with Ethlin. When they are near each other, they receive 10% bonus in Hit and avoid. Cuan clearly wins here Cuan will be doing more damage, so yeah, he's winning in offense. Not by a huge amount, though, since both will two-round the LV1 enemies. Cuan kills the higher-leveled ones faster, but those are only liek half the enemies that Cuan is winning in offense against. He loses in defenses against practically all of them, though. Cuan may have more Def, but Alec's dodging is significantly more reliable. Brigands have 70, 72, or 56 Hit. Cuan's heavy lances take his Avo down to 1, combined with WTD and they have 89, 91, or 75 Hit on him. Lawl, even with the 10 Evade from Ethlin making it 79/81/55 it's still pathetic. Alec keeps 7 of his 10 Spd, and combined with his 4 Luck that's 18 Avo. He's already winning significantly in that aspect, but then WTA gives him another 20 Evade so their Hit against him is 32/34/18. Alec is getting hit less than half the time Cuan is against the lower-leveled enemies and a third of the time against the high-leveled ones. Alec is raeping defensively. Against the Hunters, though, the difference is a lot smaller. 52 vs. 59 for the LV1 ones and 54 vs. 61 for the LV5 ones. Alec is still winning, but not by much that matters. So, against the LV1 axe enemies, Alec is winning since winning in defense > Winning in nothing. Most common enemy in the chapter, lawl. Against the LV1 Hunters, they basically tie in both offense and defense. Against the LV5 Brigands, it's also a tie since Cuan wins in offense and Alec wins in defense by about the same amount. Against the LV5 Hunters, Cuan is winning from a higher offense, but there aren't many of them. Against the LV10 Brigands, Alec wins in defense by more than Cuan wins in offense, so Alec is winning. So, Alec is winning against the most common enemy and the most dangerous one. The only enemy Cuan wins against is far from either. Alec certainly isn't being raped, he's winning at this point. Jiegan Cuan clearly wins here, and this is pretty much the same situation in chapters 1 and 2. In Ch.1, yeah, except Alec's durability win is even more important there. As for Ch.2... Alec LV12 (Steel Sword/Iron Lance) HP: 39 Atk: 22/24 Hit: 106 Evade: 27/9 (18.8/0.8) AS: 10/1 (8.8/-0.2) Def: 10 Res: 0.5 Cuan LV12 (Silver Lance) HP: 42.8 (3.8) Atk: 40 (18/16) Hit: 110.6 (4.6) Evade: 8.2 AS: 1.2 (-8.8/0.2) Def: 14 (4) Res: 3.4 (2.9) Against some of the enemies in this chapter: Vs. Free/Social Knight: Cuan 2HKOes, Alec 3HKOes. The enemies won't do much damage to either, and only have 67-68 Hit. Tie. Vs. Lance Knight: Same as Free/Social Knight, basically, except with more Hit and it'll do actual damage. Cuan can take hits better, so he wins slightly. (Alec won't take much more damage, so it isn't a huge difference) Vs. Axe Knight: Cuan 2HKOes, Alec 3HKOes. Will 3HKO Alec, but it only has ~40% Hit, lawl. Takes longer to kill Cuan, but it has a 100% chance to hit unless Ethlin is near him. A bit lower later in the chapter, but still will almost never miss Cuan while it can barely hit Alec. Alec winz. The rest either aare really rare, or compare the same as the ones I already posted. Not a huge difference between them, but Alec's wins mean more so... Jiegan By chapter 3, when Alec promotes and he may have a chance to compete, Cuan gets the Gae Bolg for massive rape. He doesn't have it the whole chapter, and he won't fight much with it. Probably the only things he would have a chance to fight are Pizarl's troops, although if you use the Warp Staff to send characters who can actually dodge axes to Madino he won't even fight them. The rest of the chapter isn't that different from Ch.2, except as you said he's doing even better than he was before. Alec can double the Wind Mages in Ch.4, which makes him a great fighter during that chapter. Alec is as awesome against the common Ch.5 axes as before, so he rapes there as well. Jiegan Being good during 4 chapters>>>>Being mediocre during 6 chapters. ...Except Cuan isn't usable for 6 chapters. %::% Jiegan As for events, in chapter one Cuan talks to Finn, giving him +1 in Str, Skl and Def. In chapter 2, Finn receives the Hero lance from Cuan. Being a very nice help for the unit who's in your party during both generations=h4x. You don't need to use Cuan to get those convos, though, you just have to field him. Which doesn't mean much, since all characters are automatically fielded. Jiegan Cuan is better in combat and benefits people. Cuan kills a few enemies faster, but Alec survives longer against almost all of 'em. Axes are probably the most common enemy weapon type, and they're where Alec's lead is at it's best. So, Cuan isn't really doing better in combat, and giving 10% Hit/Evade to Ethlin definitely isn't beating that.
	Formerly Othin


Big Boss	Sep 16 2007, 11:53 PM Post #4
Posts: 650 Group: FEFFer Member #890 Joined: August 19, 2006	Quote: Cuan will be doing more damage, so yeah, he's winning in offense. Not by a huge amount, though, since both will two-round the LV1 enemies. Cuan kills the higher-leveled ones faster, but those are only liek half the enemies that Cuan is winning in offense against. He loses in defenses against practically all of them, though. Perfect. We agree that Cuan is winning offense. I just want to mention that his amount of w1n becomes greater when he activates Continue. Quote: Cuan may have more Def, but Alec's dodging is significantly more reliable. Brigands have 70, 72, or 56 Hit. Cuan's heavy lances take his Avo down to 1, combined with WTD and they have 89, 91, or 75 Hit on him. Lawl, even with the 10 Evade from Ethlin making it 79/81/55 it's still pathetic. Alec keeps 7 of his 10 Spd, and combined with his 4 Luck that's 18 Avo. He's already winning significantly in that aspect, but then WTA gives him another 20 Evade so their Hit against him is 32/34/18. Alec is getting hit less than half the time Cuan is against the lower-leveled enemies and a third of the time against the high-leveled ones. Alec is raeping defensively. OKay, Alec wins avoid. However, during prologue, enemies attack in very small groups (except for the group coming from Evans). Even if all the enemies of a small random group hit Cuan he will survive. Then when you go assault Evans, Cuan can use the bridge to tank and receive like 2-3 hits per turn, so he survives fine. By chapter 1 there are a lot of forests at the main combat areas and Cuan's defensive stats have improved thanks to his 110% HP growth and 50% in defense. He still survives fine. By chapters 2 and 3 things get even better for Cuan, but I'll get to that later. Quote: Against the Hunters, though, the difference is a lot smaller. 52 vs. 59 for the LV1 ones and 54 vs. 61 for the LV5 ones. Alec is still winning, but not by much that matters. Quote: Against the LV1 Hunters, they basically tie in both offense and defense. Quote: Against the LV5 Hunters, Cuan is winning from a higher offense, but there aren't many of them. Hunters, hmm? 7 Avoid vs. countering with the Javelin and thus killing them in 1 turn (1 turn being your phase + enemy phase). Seems like a clear win for Cuan. Quote: So, against the LV1 axe enemies, Alec is winning since winning in defense > Winning in nothing. Most common enemy in the chapter, lawl. Against the LV5 Brigands, it's also a tie since Cuan wins in offense and Alec wins in defense by about the same amount. Against the LV10 Brigands, Alec wins in defense by more than Cuan wins in offense, so Alec is winning. Quote: So, Alec is winning against the most common enemy and the most dangerous one. The only enemy Cuan wins against is far from either. Alec certainly isn't being raped, he's winning at this point. Soez, offense is called "nothing" now? Interesting. Cuan's base attack is already better, and yet he has Continue to make even more ample his lead. Cuan is around level 8-9 through chapter 1. His 12 Spd is negated by the weight of his lance so his chance of activating Continue is 20%. One rounding 20% of the time>>>>>One rounding 0% of the time. May I also mention that when continue activates during your turn Cuan also wins defense because the enemy dies before having a chance to attack? As already said before, Cuan is benefiting Ethlin. All the stuff mentioned above vs better avoid. Alec got raep'd. Now, chapter 2. Your levels seem accurate so I'll go with that. Quote: Vs. Free/Social Knight: Cuan 2HKOes, Alec 3HKOes. The enemies won't do much damage to either, and only have 67-68 Hit. Tie. Taking as an example a free knight from Voltz's group, I see the guy has 9 Str and an Iron sword for 15 Mt. Deals 1 damage to Cuan and 5 to Alec. Definitely a noteworthy difference considering the size of the enemy group. Then you proved that Cuan wins offense, so how is that a tie? Quote: Vs. Lance Knight: Same as Free/Social Knight, basically, except with more Hit and it'll do actual damage. Cuan can take hits better, so he wins slightly. (Alec won't take much more damage, so it isn't a huge difference) A lance knight from Elliot group looks like... 38 HP, 21 Atk, 8 Def It deals 7 damage to Cuan and 11 to Alec. Cuan dies in the 7th round of combat, Alec dies in the 4th round of combat. A considerable difference, I'd say. Also, since this enemy is using a lance, Alec has to eother equip a lance and raep his avoid, or equip a sword and get his avoid raeped because of WTD. Offensively, Cuan wins just like against the Free/social knight. Quote: Vs. Axe Knight: Cuan 2HKOes, Alec 3HKOes. Will 3HKO Alec, but it only has ~40% Hit, lawl. Takes longer to kill Cuan, but it has a 100% chance to hit unless Ethlin is near him. A bit lower later in the chapter, but still will almost never miss Cuan while it can barely hit Alec. Alec winz. 40% hit isn't that laughable in this game since it uses just 1 RN to determine hit. Also, looking at things realistically, the axe knights come accompanied by other type of enemies, so overall Cuan's defense is probably better. Offensively, Cuan wins, I agree. Quote: The rest either aare really rare, or compare the same as the ones I already posted. Not a huge difference between them, but Alec's wins mean more so... I would still like to bring some other type of enemies to our comparison. Armor Knight guards at Augusty. 50 HP, 13 DEF. Cuan definitely wins offensively, and since these guys have lances, Alec loses his avoid Ballistas at Augusty. 16 Atk. Each one deals 6 damage to Alec. Between that and Zyne's group he can easily die. The ballistas scratch Cuan for 2 damage so some arrows can hit him and he will still be stabbing some mother fuckers with a minor chance of dying. pwn. Bow Knights (Iron bow). 17 Atk. They scratch Cuan while he counters with javelin. 'nuff said. With all these comparisons it's settled Cuan's superiority here. Quote: He doesn't have it the whole chapter, and he won't fight much with it. Probably the only things he would have a chance to fight are Pizarl's troops, although if you use the Warp Staff to send characters who can actually dodge axes to Madino he won't even fight them. The rest of the chapter isn't that different from Ch.2, except as you said he's doing even better than he was before. Indeed, Cuan doesn't get it during the whole chapter, but during the time he does, he rapes the Orgahil troops. And he isn't worried about axes hitting him thanks to the +10 Def bonus of the Gae Bolg. Before that, most of the enemies are of the same type of the ones at chapter 2, with the addition of Wyverns that have solid attack and defense. Alec struggles a lot against them. Quote: Alec can double the Wind Mages in Ch.4, which makes him a great fighter during that chapter. Alec is as awesome against the common Ch.5 axes as before, so he rapes there as well. Wind mages also love Alec's low resistance. By chapter 5, Alec is pretty bad since the rest of your team is at their best. Ayra, Beowulf and Holyn rape axe dudes, Sigurd and Levin have their divine weapons, Alec and his horse have to cross the desert. Things aren't looking good. Quote: ...Except Cuan isn't usable for 6 chapters. %::% Exactly. Cuan is the good unit for 4 chapters. Alec is the mediocre one for 6 chapters. %::% Quote: You don't need to use Cuan to get those convos, though, you just have to field him. Which doesn't mean much, since all characters are automatically fielded. The hero lance is gotten at halfway trough the map, just before facing a group of sword knights. You also have to capture Heirhein under 11 turns to save all villages. Cuan helps a lot. You want to field him. Quote: Cuan kills a few enemies faster, but Alec survives longer against almost all of 'em. Axes are probably the most common enemy weapon type, and they're where Alec's lead is at it's best. So, Cuan isn't really doing better in combat, and giving 10% Hit/Evade to Ethlin definitely isn't beating that. Cuan kills all enemies faster, and survives better against everything in chapters 2 and 3. And in prologue and chapter, he doesn't have much risk of dying in the first place.
	^^by comatose from NationalSigLeague^^ Kratos/Jeigan


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