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| Reikken vs Inui | |
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| Topic Started: Sep 22 2007, 01:03 PM (647 Views) | |
| +Ema Skye | Sep 22 2007, 01:03 PM Post #1 |
Snackoos = <3. It's science!
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well well well we meet again in the finals for the 5th time or some shit lol i'm keeping GARRET |
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| Reikken | Sep 29 2007, 02:53 PM Post #2 |
 
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Cecilia joins two and part of a third chapters before Garret, and she gains exp faster than a level 15 unit even though she's 20/1. Same kill exp as a 15/0, plus she has staves. She's level 5 by the time Garret joins, and she's still gaining exp faster than him, so her level lead will increase moar, and she's obviously better at exp rank. NOW supprtz Garrrret supports Lalum, Gonzales, and Geese. He's Lalum's worst support by far, so lol @ that Gonzales has Echidna and Treck, and they both start way earlier, so he'd rather support one of them. Geese has Echidna and Lalum, and they also both start way earlier, so he would also rather support one of them. He may be able to snag a C or two, or if he's lucky, a B with Gonzales, but that's it, and that B doesn't appear until late. Cecilia supports Percival, Saul, and Roy. Percival is hurting for supports, so he wants this one for sure. Ditto on Saul, except to an even greater degree. Roy has a B with Alan and Lance easy, but that leaves a C open. She's easily getting full supports, and her supports also help her supporters moar. In defense, Garret wins massively in hp, and Cecilia wins massively in res. Garret starts out winning by a bit in def, but Cecilia passes him with a higher growth, higher exp gain, and more from supports, so they're pretty even there. They start out with about the same avo, but Cecilia quickly starts owning him since her supports are faster, fuller, and give full avoid. Garret gets like +5, while Cecilia gets +25. Garret wins offense with higher atk and crit but less hit, and Cecilia has staves. exp rank + supports + defense + staves > offense |
| NP: Wind Waker, Clannad, Ever17, Shoddy Battle, Brawl (Wi-Fi) | |
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| +Ema Skye | Sep 30 2007, 12:48 AM Post #3 |
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Snackoos = <3. It's science!
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 Garret is  while Cecilia is :feez:, so that's already a win for him. Why even bother continuing this debaet?Well, free raep against the best debaeter ftw? I guess so.
Mathematically, yes. In the actual game, no. You see, when Cecilia joins you, she's nearly capped in her Suck stat, which will be abbreviated to SUK to fit in with the other abbreviations from now on. So, her SUK stat is too high for her to do anything. She's crippled in the desert, and can't even hit things properly. She starts off with 104 Hit with Aircalibur, and the Mercs in the desert have 46 Evd according to Sentenal's enemy samples. That leaves Cecilia with 58 Hit, lol. And the suck doesn't stop there. Cecilia only does 16 damage once with 0 Crit to its 35 HP if she even hits. The Merc can do 14 x 2 damage to her, and has 77 Hit. Omg, massive raep against a level 16 unpromoted unit. How is she even making any use of this EXP bonus? Answer: She's not. The Killing Edge Hero in this chapter does 18 x 2 damage, which one-rounds Cecilia, and he has 85 Hit and 29 Crit. That's utter rape. Let's take something totally crappy, the worst possible enemy on the entire map, a Hand Axe!Brigand. Cecilia does 16 damage once to its 40 HP and has 77 Hit. The Brigand hits back once for 16 damage as well to Cecilia's 30 HP, and lucky for her, the Brigand only has 33 Hit on her. However, these guys swarm, only two need to hit in order for her to die. The Wyvern Lord brings her down to 1 HP, and she can't even one-round it due to 0 Crit. Even with boosted Aircalibur damage, she won't even outdamage someone that doubles it. The Mamkutes and Rose OHKO her, and Maggie has a high chance of a OHKO thanks to his huge Crit. Things don't really get much better from here. In 14x, she has to fight the same things except the average enemy level went up by about 1, and Ohtz can one-round her with Bolting. She's killed in two hits by everything, and the things that don't kill her in two hits can double her. There are also Druids that wtfraep her terribly in this chapter. In 15, things still aren't looking better. The Mercs still double her, she still has poor Hit, and things destroy her in two hits. The Valks also double her, and she doesn't do anything to them. So, basically, she's sucking massively at fighting, and the EXP boost only applies to EXP gained in combat, IIRC, so her bonus doesn't matter. She can't fight. While Cecilia is adding massive SUK to your party, Garret is off looting villages and raping women or something else evil and manly for fun. Then, Garret joins you halfway through Chapter 15, and his HM boosts make him pretty strong. That renders this statement: clearly false. Cecilia will be at level 3 if she's your primary healer or something, but Saul, Ellen, and Clarine are already there, and are way better than her. Later on, Lugh promotes, and possibly Ray and Hugh, and then Niime is a decent filler, etc. She's even failing at this healing business.
Okay, let's see if they make up for Garret's astronomical stat leads.
Yeah, no Lalum most of the time indeed. If Treck doesn't die before he's recruited, sure. Or if he's fielded at all. He's not really that good. He has doubling issues and his durability isn't not top-notch thanks to sucky RES and the worst defensive support in the game. If Geese is used, then maybe, but you forget that Echidna and Lalum already have other people. Echidna is going to score A Lalum/B Gonzales. That's almost a given. That means Geese is still free if he's used. Looks like A Geese/B Gonzales is pretty reasonable for the endgame. The supports are slow, but he'll have double C's by the time Sacae/Ilia starts (Chapter 18 is what I mean).
Well, she can get Percival sometimes, but there are a few problems with that. Percival likes to rush off and rape and abuse his insanely high stats, while Cecilia gets killed by everything. That's a bit of a problem. Also, Percival has other options. There may be movement issues with Douglas, but he offers better bonuses(full Crit > partial Atk), and Douglas can survive the enemy phase without camping behind everyone. If you take the route without Echidna, then not only are Gonzales and Geese completely free for Garret, but Elphin joins instead, and that's a fast support for Percival. Klein, a unit better at both living and fighting than Cecilia, offers Percival another speedy support with full Evd and full Hit, which are the best possibly bonuses for Percival besides Crit. Lalum also supports him, and Dorothy wouldn't mind him if she's used, and she gives Percival full Evd, full Crit, and full Hit, which is his best support bonus-wise. Even Percival doesn't look very likely for her. Saul is indeed hurting pretty badly, however, not badly enough that Cecilia instantly gets him. Saul can be supporting Dorothy at an A by the time Cecilia even joins, and then Ellen is also there for him. Igrene, who's basically like Klein with better bases but worse supports, also supports Saul without being frail as glass like Cecilia and she can actually fight things. Roy's looking unlikely to me, too. He can C the following units before Cecilia even exists: Lilina, Marcus, Wolt, Sue, Thany, Lalum. He can C the following units after Cecilia joins: Sophia, Cecilia. In order for Cecilia to even have a chance at that C, Lilina, Wolt, Sue, and Thany have to all not be fielded. In addition to that, Marcus makes for a good earlygame and midgame C support, and Marcus could even be used in the longrun without losing much to Cecilia; Cecilia isn't even faster than Marcus, and Marcus is more durable. Sophia has a capped SUK stat from the very start, so that's a very likely one at all. Lalum usually doesn't want Roy. So, Cecilia isn't exactly winning supports by as much as you say, if at all.
The HP win is certainly more significant. Garret is clearly winning against all things that use melee, and the HP matters more against magic users unless they're getting swarmed by them. If Garret has 55 HP and Cecilia has 32 HP, and a mage with something like 24 Atk hits them both, Garret ends up with 36 HP and Cecilia ends up with 22 HP. Next round reduces Garret to 17, and then 0. Cecilia then goes to 12 HP, and then 2. Cecilia's huge RES lead doesn't matter at all on the first hit, Garret still wins on the second, and then Cecilia wins on the third.
No. I've addressed supports already, so that's not really making her win. And then this nonexistant big level lead you speak of doesn't exist. Garret starts with 10 DEF, she starts with 7 DEF. Garret's growth is worse, but it's nowhere near worse enough for Cecilia to even come close to winning in raw stats, and then Garret still gets +1 from supports eventually.
Cecilia doesn't get full supports just like that, so whatever. Garret will end up getting +12 eventually, but it's indeed +5-7 for most of the game. Against the hordes of lance users in the Ilia route and the Wyverns of Bern, Garret is getting +10 to close that gap anyways, and then he's still winning HP massively and DEF by a bit, so he's more durable. It's also harder for enemies to double him. 10 SPD with 25% growth vs 11.2 SPD with a 25% growth makes Garret teh winnar in Atk Spd easily. Consistent 1.2 lead at the same levels.
Less Hit? Hmm. Cecilia: 20/8 w/ C Roy/C Douglas(Thunder/Elfire) Atk: 20.4/22.4 Hit: 108.3/103.3 Crit: 15/10 Atk Spd: 11.8 Garret: 20/5 w/ C Gonzales(Iron/Killer/Hand) Atk: 30.3/33.3/29.3 Hit: 107.1/107.1/92.1 Crit: 43/73/43 Atk Spd: 12.2 What the hell? Cecilia's only winning Hit with Thunder. What, you want Fire? Then she has no Atk. Garret crushes her in Atk and Crit and has stuff like Halberd/Hammer/Swordreaver/Killer Axe. Garret is also slightly faster even when Cecilia has a level lead. Garret utterly crushes her offense. Staves? Lol. She has them, but doesn't get to use them much at all, as I said.
You put "defense" on the wrong side, and supports is even or Cecilia wins slightly. "Offense" means he's winning Combat easily, too. Another minor advantage for Garret is that he's cheaper. Costs Per Use Iron: 6 Steel: 12 Hand: 15 Devil: 45 Halberd: 45 Hammer: 40 Reaver: 140 Killer: 50 Brave: 75 Silver: 50 Tomahawk: 200 Fire: 14 Thunder: 20 Elfire: 40 Aircalibur: 55 Fimbulvetr: 260 Bolting: 600 Looks like Garret can swap between stuff like Iron and Killer freely and still cost loss than Cecilia unless she's only using Fire. However, Fire has such terrible Mt that her offense plummets into nothingness. She doesn't have high Mag or a Crit boost to make up for it. Hell, she doesn't even have the ability to double to give her some offense. Staves cost moneyz too, and the high rank ones are very expensive. Did you pick a terrible unit out of pity or something? I'm not that bad. |
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| Reikken | Oct 8 2007, 01:59 PM Post #4 |
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What you talkin bout, Willis?
First off, the Mercs average 41 avo. 14-17 spd, 1 AS loss, and, 6-8 lck. +5 from the terrain. Sentenal's enemy samples are probably just the highest he can find or something, I dunno. 63 (73%) hit with Aircalibur, 73 (85.7%) with Fire. Anyway, so every enemy on the map is a Merc, huh? Let's compare Garret against the Mercs when he joins, then. He has about 51 (52.5%) hit on them with a Killer Axe, and his hit doesn't go any higher. When he attacks, unlike Cecilia, he gets doubled with a counterattack for 14x2, and then it takes just one to finish him on enemy phase. Cecilia needs 2 thanks to not taking a counterattack. And the best part? If it's an enemy she's bad against, she can still be just as useful for she can do other things, such as use staves. Garret? He either sits there and does nothing, or he gets raped. And often healing is better regardless. Saving someone from death and/or allowing them to go continue fighting >>>> attacking and maybe killing an enemy.
o noz. Who cares? It's one enemy, and it rapes alot of people. Even Alan can get one-rounded by it. If Garret was decent against it, then sure, but that's obviously not the case.
Worst possible enemy on the map = Steel Axe Brigand or Steel Lance Wyvern Rider. Hand Axe Brigand is actually one of the ones she does the worst against (for Player Phase at least) since it has 1-2 range.
Wtf? Cecilia does about 33 damage to it. (2-3 res, 16-17 def, 12-13 spd) For a physical attacker to do that much with a double, they would need about 33 atk. It takes a fully supported already promoted Alan to reach that, and that's a bit unlikely. 19/0 Alan has way less than that much atk and doesn't double. 19/0 Lance does about 21 damage. Only Gonzales, level ~18 doubles with 32 atk to almost match Cecilia. No one else even comes close. Cecilia is actually one of the best for killing this thing since nearly anyone is dying in 2 hits (and that 1 hp isn't much of a problem since this is her at base, so her stats are RNG-proof, and this is on the higher side of the Wyvern Lord's str) but Cecilia doesn't take a counterattack, and your other anima user dies in 1 hit; and she does high damage, easily killing it in two hits.
Mm-hmm. This doesn't matter at all. The Mamkutes have low range and don't move unless you're in range, and the 2 Berserkers start several turns later and way behind you.
and everyone's avoid drops by 5 "Druids that wtfraep her terribly"? What are you talking about? There's only one Druid that attacks, and it's no more dangerous than anything else. No, she's not overly durable, but most others aren't either, and Cecilia isn't taking counterattacks and isn't always fighting and is healing instead, and she has high mobility for good placement, so there's no problem.
Garret joins here. Now...who cares? Garret is even worse off, as shown above, and his only role is fighting. Way to phail.
Saul and Ellen can attack as well. Even if you don't need as many heals as you have staff users, and you very often will--this is FE6, afterall-- letting Saul or Ellen attack instead of heal = +that much offense, and they have pretty good offense thanks to being already promoted. Lugh is indeed later on, out of the context of this section of the discussion, and even once he does promote, see above. The others are also later on, but they're also "lolnothx, I'd rather not use sucky units."
You haven't done anything to show that Cecilia is even suck, let alone massive suck. "This enemy can pwn her!" "Oh wait, a top tier unit can get pwned as well". So she doesn't wtfraep enemies. Okay? This is FE6, not FE7. Enemies don't suck and get raepd. If she was sucking compared to everyone else, then sure, but that's not the case. She's actually pretty well off as she can both attack and heal, and she's mounted but without the slayer weaknesses since horseslayers are only effective against paladins and cavaliers.
Treck doesn't die before he's recruited. Rescue/drop, and he's recruited on turn 2 every time. Indeed Treck may not be used, but Geese is about as good as Treck, so he's also getting not used about as much.
A Lalum B Geese > A Lalum B Gonzales - support triangle - Echidna needs offense moar: she's already getting full avo and near-full def
More like Geese isn't getting used at all because he has no supports until a C midway through Ilia/Sacae. Gonzales is also worse: -3.5 spd, -exp rank bonus, etc., and Treck is his only support for forever, so if Treck doesn't get used, he goes supportless for about as long as Geese, so he also becomes iffy. If Geese is used: C Geese, B(A) Gonzales. A in parenthesis because he's not actually going to reach that. It's 180 turns, and 10 chapters later already sees ch 22. If Geese isn't used and Treck is: C Gonzales If Geese isn't used and Treck isn't either: B(A) Gonzales not looking too good for Garret
He may do this occasionally, but not often because there are enemies in the way, and his stats with supports >>> his stats unsupported. It's not much of an issue. If there are few enough enemies nearby that Percival should run away, Cecilia isn't in much danger anyway.
Full crit is indeed > half atk, but that's not the difference here. It's half crit vs half atk (half crit + half crit vs half crit + half atk). Any difference between those is minimal at best. More importantly, Douglas blows and isn't getting used. He has good def, sure, but low res and low avoid, and he gets doubled all the time, so his durability isn't that impressive, and everything else about him sucks.
Whether or not Klein is better than Cecilia doesn't matter as he's still worse than loads of others who are getting on the team instead of him. He may be used for a few chapters if you just need an overleveled dude for some reason, but not as a permanent team member.
No, Dorothy sucks and isn't getting used. She has a terrible class that gets no weapons or crit boost or anything on promotion and can never counter melee, and she joins underleveled with crappy bases. Igrene isn't much better. Klein is better than her, and he's not good himself. Whether or not she's better than Cecilia doesn't matter as she's still worse than loads of others who are getting on the team instead of her.
And they're all utterly horrible, except Thany, who's just normal horrible, so not using any of them is by far the best option.
How good Marcus is compared to Cecilia has zero relevance. This is Cecilia vs Garret, not Cecilia vs Marcus. Dropping Marcus after earlygame for someone else >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> continuing to use him, and Marcus is almost never next to Roy earlygame anyway because he's off making himself useful with his 8 move and good bases instead, so Roy's definitely not getting a Marcus support.
Indeed, after two hits, Garret's hp lead is pretty much gone, and three leaves Cecilia winning slightly, and that carries over after healing, since your units don't heal enough to fully heal Garret, so no, the hp lead isn't more significant. And that's only at the start, before growths, levels, and supports, all of which Cecilia beats Garret in. Go to liek the start of ch 20x, right when Garret's hp caps, before his hp growth starts being wasted, and assuming Geese gets used: Garret, 20/9, C Geese, C Gonzales: 60 hp, 5.4 res Cecilia, 20/15, A Percival, C Roy, C Saul: 38.4 hp, 19.5 res And yes, staves + class exp bonus makes Cecilia reach 10 levels in the time Garret reaches 8. After two hits, Cecilia wins by 6. Garret doesn't reach B Gonzales for +1 res (and 2 avo) until probably most of the way through ch 21. That helps, but his hp has also stopped growing. For the rest of durability, Garret starts with 2 more def, so he would win except Cecilia doesn't take counters. Then, back to ch 20x: Garret: 11.2 def, 46.1 avo Cecilia: 12.8 def, 65.5 avo and on top of that, she still almost never takes counters, so her durability >> his. Related to durability, Cecilia can always counter ranged, while Garret can't and has phail hit when he switches to a ranged weapon.
and he gets -10 along with -1 def against the things that double him
Things that don't happen don't matter. They're never on the same level.
fix'd Also, Garret has a 57.5% hit growth while Cecilia's is 102.5%.
And Cecilia has Aircalibur. And... Garret's hit with Halberd: 96.8 Garret's hit with Hammer: 86.8 There's only one Swordreaver in the game, it has only 20 uses, and both his supporters are axe-only, so he's never seeing that thing. And reavers don't double the weapon triangle like in FE7 anyway. You already included Killer Axe, nub.
Er... Try weapons they might actually use: Iron: 6 Hand: 15 Halberd: 45 Hammer: 40 Killer: 50 Silver: 50 Fire: 14 Thunder: 20 Elfire: 40 Aircalibur: 55 Minor indeed. It's about as minor as Cecilia having a much better shot at using Forblaze because of there being only one other S anima dude while lots of other S axe dudes exist.
Okay...? If they didn't, she would be clearly winning in funds. And I dunno what that rant about Fire having low mt is supposed to mean. The gap between Fire and Iron == gap between Aircalibur and Killer. Anything I skipped I already countered earlier. |
| NP: Wind Waker, Clannad, Ever17, Shoddy Battle, Brawl (Wi-Fi) | |
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| +Ema Skye | Oct 20 2007, 07:25 PM Post #5 |
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Snackoos = <3. It's science!
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That's fine. It was still a viable sample, and the decreases don't change the fact that they rape Cecilia horribly and she can't do anything to them.
Garret is prepromoted and uses the cheapest weapon type. Not giving him a Swordreaver for such situations is ridiculous. And so, against your Merc: ~89 Real Hit if WTA is double with reavers which I'm not sure on, and ~78 if it's not, with ~36 Crit. The Merc now only has ~50 Hit or so with double WTA and ~60 with normal WTA. If you just attack with another unit and damage the Merc first, Garret will slay it easily since he does massive damage. Cecilia's chances of dodging are almost nothing. She's also left in much worse shape after taking an attack due to Garret's huge HP and DEF wins.
What is Garret bad against? He easily crushes lance users and can counter sword users with WTA. Axe users have bad Evd and Hit anyways. The only enemies I can think of that he's awful against are Nomads, Swordmasters, and magic users that get to attack first, and Cecilia's even worse against those(except the magic pplz, but she can't damage them). Cecilia can run around healing and healing forever and it won't make you complete a chapter or finish the game. Garret kills things to allow you to progress. Cecilia's healing can easily be substituted for by the plethora of superior magic users in your party and healing items. Healing doesn't complete chapters. Fighting is always needed, and Garret's good at it. When he joins, he has massive Atk and Crit, and is only losing Atk Spd to your party, and not even by that much sans gods like Rutger and Lance. He will have the highest HP of all your units until he starts cap ramming.
He'd be better than Cecilia against it with a Swordreaver, that's for sure.
That barely changes anything. Cecilia can attack it without getting countered, but she takes more damage when it attacks her, and she's still sucking terribly. Garret can one-round crappy things like weighed down Brigands, but Cecilia can't.
But average level went up to make up for that, and Cecilia's Hit is still bleh. Well, she can't damage them, and the one that attacks her indeed destroys her. Actually, anything that attacks her will wreck her. She will have the worst durability in your party by far. Even units like Clarine, Lalum, and Lugh that will have less raw Def and less HP will be more durable thanks to actually dodging things and having supports. You kidding me? At this point, most of your units are perfectly fine. Who's going to die? Lance, Alan, Echidna. Rutger, Gonzales, Dieck, etc? No way. They're indeed "overly durable" when compared to the glass that is Cecilia. The only units she can possibly make a case of durabilty against are the ones with crap HP that don't have super h4x Evd yet, like Lugh.
No, he's not, as shown above.
They're inferior at attacking compared to a large amount of units, so they're mostly healing. Allowing them to attack is handy, but it's a minimal point for Cecilia at best. Clarine, Saul, and Ellen are all currently healing. In addition to this, you can look forward to having Lugh and Ray-if-you're-using-him healing. Later than this, you have filler like Niime and Yodel that can outdo Cecilia. Well, Niime pwns her in offense, at least.
She has abysmal durability and offense. Possibly the worst on your team. That's indeed massive suck. Worst on team = worst possible = massive suck. She's completely incapable of one-rounding and very easily killed. The numbers show it. Even the weak enemies are raping her. And she is sucking compared to everyone else. Cecilia at base: 30 HP, 7 Def, 13 Res, 30 Evd, 10 Crit Evd, 10 Atk Spd Underleveled Dieck only at 15/0 with just C Rutger/C Clarine: 35 HP, 9 Def, 3.5 Res, 41.5 Evd, 18.5 Crit Evd, 13 Atk Spd lulz, even when deprived, Dieck rapes her. Here's some lulz: Level 15 Astol with no supports: 29.5 HP, 8 Def, 4 Res, 46.8 Evd, 11.8 Crit Evd, 17.5 Atk Spd Base level Bartre: 48 HP, 10 Def, 3 Res, 34 Evd, 14 Crit Evd, 10 Atk Spd Base level Marcus deprived of EXP and supports: 32 HP, 9 Def, 8 Res, 32 Evd, 10 Crit Evd, 11 Atk Spd What the fuck? She's losing to garbage. Even Marcus would be raping her if given a few levels and just C Roy or something, lol. This is terrible. Beyond terrible. Cecilia is glass. Must I go on?
Uh, whatever. Both get used sometimes.
Geese is still free for a C. Gonzales is now even more free. Works for me.
Use Cath, lol. And yes, Gonzales is worse off, and the EXP rank suffers a tiny bit, but it's not a huge problem. You're not going to always take the Echidna route. Taking it most of the time is understandable, though. The point here I'm trying to make is that Garret just snags C's with the likes of Geese/Gonzales almost all the time. And even with minimal supports, he's winning.
He gets better bonuses from Klein, Lalum, and Douglas. And Klein and Douglas crush Cecilia in defense, and Klein crushes her in offense, and Douglas even wins offense in a lot of cases. The only thing she has on them is a horse and staves. But she dies easily and they are very hard to kill, and they can fight better, and that's better. Glass on a horse is still glass.
5 Crit > 2.5 Crit + 0.5 Atk. It's minimal, but Percival wants Crit more. Cecilia blows, too. Douglas can survive and actually give bonuses on the frontline. He's only getting doubled a bit more than Cecilia, really only in the cases of Mercs that cling him and Wyvern Lords. However, his Evd gets decent after supports since he has a great defensive affinity, and is Def gets even more insane. Steel vs Glass, lol. I'd let steel support me over glass even if the steel moves around slower.
He's fine. Not unfieldable at all. He's a viable support partner. You don't always use the elite of the elite when you play, which is why we're debating these units in the first place. He's more fieldable than Cecilia.
Well, yeah, but let's say you let her tag along to give Saul some actual supports and peck at things. She can just poke things and gain some levels before Cecilia joins. She can gain get to 15/0 by poking and following Saul. Level 13/0 Dorothy w/ B Saul Defense: 29.2 HP, 6.8 Def, 4.8 Res, 40 Evd, 12.2 Crit Evd Offense: 12 Atk, 36.4 Hit, 10.7 Crit, 11.4 Atk Spd She's beating Cecilia in stats at a lower level. >_>; Cecilia counters that with a horse and staves, though. Against Igrene, it's even moar lulz. Igrene has way better bases than Cecilia. her base Atk Spd is Cecilia's 20/20 Atk Spd. My point is that Cecilia's stats don't even exist when compared to garbage. That's what I've been driving at here. Her stats are abysmal. Her only positives are a horse and staves. Garret actually has stats.
Indeed. Individually, they have very low chances of being fielded. Combined, one of them is likely to be used, and then Cecilia has no chance for that C with Roy.
They can be next to each other for 15 turns before Cecilia joins and get that support. Using Marcus after the earlygame is probably better than using Cecilia at all. Marcus is way more durable, for starters. He can actually use a whole crapload of weapons like slayer/killer/silver to make up for shitty offense. He has more Atk Spd than Cecilia. Cecilia's single advantage is staves. Personally, I'd rather field Marcus forever than use Cecilia at all, because Marcus can survive and use awesome weapons to make up for his shortcomings in offense. Cecilia doesn't have this, and nothing ever helps her insanely low Atk Spd.
That's why Mend was invented. Or Recover. Also, melee users are way more common. Cecilia has nothing to make up for this. Garret can get WTA vs two melee weapons and has huge HP for melee users, and huge HP to make up for bad RES. Cecilia has nothing. Cecilia was actually given a three level lead when I did that comparison.
She's not healing enough to gain that much EXP. Saul, Ellen, and Clarine exist. All are way better. And Lugh, Ray, and Hugh can be promoted. Those supports aren't happening, or at least really rare. She's not making any use of that class bonus because she can barely enter combat. She's abysmal at living at fighting. So, no; these comparisons are incorrect and slanted towards Cecilia. I'm not going to repost stuff I already said, so I'll just say this was countered by stuff posted above, which it was.
Those are less common around then, but... Swordreaver means he gets WT bonuses. Yay for being a cheap prepromoted d00d.
Oh no, his SPD lead is a bit smaller than that! It's still a lead.
Seems more like you broke it, actually. That's fine. Garret's Hit base is way bigger, so it's fine. His affinity also gives Hit.
Okay. She still sucks. Your point? He has WTA. Your point? He has WTA and Generals/Knights have crap Evd. Only one in the entire game? You can't ever buy them? Are you sure? I was certain there were more.
Cecilia's base Atk is too crappy for her to deal damage with Fire. Garret's base Atk is huge, so he can do a lot with Iron. |
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4:20 PM Nov 8
