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| Tino_1190 vs. Exilon; Titania vs. Tanith | |
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| Topic Started: Jan 6 2008, 02:32 PM (313 Views) | |
| Tino | Jan 6 2008, 02:32 PM Post #1 |
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Coming soon. EDIT: Muarim vs. Tanith, not Titania vs. Tanith. |
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| Zorak | Jan 7 2008, 09:10 AM Post #2 |
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K good luck  Tanith is useful immediately; she joins automatically and has a level lead over most units, statistically she should compete and beat some of your units. The fact that she is a pre promote is helpful considering the limited amount of EXP available, since she only needs 1000 EXP to cap her level, thus not stealing from other units as much. Her weapon level is very high as well, meaning that she will only have to worry about levelling lances to A, which only takes 15 double attacks and with Tanith’s high AS this is very easy to do in like two – three chapters. Supports: Oscar: Very good unit, but he is already full. Marcia: Very good unit and definitely worth, since both are flyers they should be sticking together most of the time, they also rise each others already great avoid. Reyson: Excellent unit, Reyson should always be supporting Tanith since Ike is full, the bonuses grant even more avoid, something that Reyson needs greatly. So Tanith gets Marcia A and Reyson B. Who is Muarim supporting? Lethe won’t be fielded for much, her support bonuses are terrible and it requires one of them to stay without a demi band, no way. Largo comes late and under levelled, he isn’t getting used, and even if he was the bonuses would kick in very late in the game to hardly matter. Zihark, sure, he is getting this support, but the turn requirement means he will be getting the full bonus late game. So Zihark A. Also Tanith arrives with Reinforce, a very useful skill, the pegasi are excellent for killing enemy reinforcements, baiting attacks or even just keeping up with the army. Since they help you clear chapter faster you are rewarded more BEXP, w00t. Let’s compare their stats by the time Tanith joins, chapter 18. Tanith lvl 10 Steel lance 26.0 atk, 24.0 AS, 124.0 hit, 8.8 crit 66.0 avo, 32.0 hp, 15.0 def, 13.0 res, 18.0 critavo Muarim Demi Band lvl 11 Tiger claw Zihark C 30.4 atk, 18.1 AS, 134.5 hit, 7.9 crit 54.9 avo, 47.9 hp, 15.2 def, 7.9 res, 11.7 critavo Offensively Muarim only has a 4 attack lead, but Tanith has a 6 AS lead meaning she will double more often, plus she has a better crit chance. Defensibly Muarim has a considerable HP lead, but all his other stats lose out to Tanith except def, where they are tied; Tanith has more res, avoid and critavo. Tanith is weak to arrows and wind, Muarim is weak to fire. Regarding arrows, archers aren’t common in this chapter at all, and the ballistae are only a threat on ch 19 23 24 and 25, their bonus is nullified by Full Guard and even without it you can use reinforce as bait since they are always targeted over your units. Wind is hardly a threat because Tanith’s resistance is so high, plus the low mt from wind tomes make it even less of a threat. A lv 13 Sage with Tornado needs to hit 3 times to kill a lv 10 Tanith  Muarim’s res is bad, the only thing that saves him from getting destroyed by fire is his HP, a lv 1 Sage with Bolganone 3HKs a lv 11 Muarim, also enemies with long range magic are more common than ballistae. Now late game stats. Tanith lvl 20 HP 38.0 ATK 20.0 MAG 13.5 SKL 24.8 SPD 27.4 DEF 17.5 RES 16.0 LCK 21.0 Muarim Demi band lvl 20 HP 60.9 ATK 27.7 MAG 4.5 SKL 22.7 SPD 22.1 DEF 20.6 RES 12.0 LCK 14.8 Muarim wins HP - 22.9 ATK - 7.7 DEF - 3.1 Tanith wins MAG - 9 SKL - 2.1 SPD – 5.3 RES - 4 LCK - 6.2 Now with supports and weapons applied. Tanith lvl 20 Silver Lance A Marcia B Reyson 37.0 atk, 27.4 AS, 157.6 hit, 12.2 crit 100.8 avo, 38.0 hp, 17.5 def, 16.0 res, 21.0 critavo Muarim Demi Band lvl 20 Tiger Claw A Zihark 36.7 atk, 22.1 AS, 150.2 hit, 11.1 crit 81.0 avo, 60.9 hp, 21.6 def, 13.0 res, 14.8 critavo Tanith manages to beat Muarim in atk and AS, making her the better offensive choice; she also has weapon variety, which include 1-2 range and magic weapons, in fact, Tanith is the best candidate for the Flame lance due to her good mag, double mt against beast laguz. Muarim is always stuck with claws. Tanith lvl 20 Steel Lance A Marcia B Reyson 32.0 atk, 27.4 AS, 152.6 hit, 12.2 crit 100.8 avo, 38.0 hp, 17.5 def, 16.0 res, 21.0 critavo Only change is lower hit and 4.7 less attack, she is still the better offensive choice due to her speed. In durability she looses out on HP by 22.9 and in def by 3.1, but she wins res and has 19.8 more avoid. And this is all without mentioning her flyer utility, which is very helpful on the late game chapters with mountains. She has offence and utility through the whole game Tanith >>> Muarim |
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| Tino | Jan 7 2008, 03:47 PM Post #3 |
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Well thank you. Good luck to you too.
Muarim is, too. He is one of your best characters when he joins. The only thing you have to do to recruit him is killing him, and then he joins automatically. And the fact that you have to kill him once also slightly helps gaining experience. I know it’s not much, but at least it’s something.
Perhaps when she joins, as the game continues she will grow weaker and weaker compared to most of your other characters. And she’s also reaching ??/20 very early so she’s just fielded gaining no experience while others need that experience. Not good. And not using her full-time, which I expect you to counter this with, means she’s not going to reach that A Lances early, what you were talking about. “Muarim is also reaching ??/20 fast and should thus also not be used a lot, lulz.” Sure, but then he also doesn’t have to care about those Weapon Levels you have to raise.
Hmm, you see, Muarim is a Laguz. He comes at level 9, and ~2 chapters before Tanith, so it’s even easier to level him and he’s taking even less experience away.
Sure. So what? So that she can use a Silver Lance? ‘K. That’s really nice for her. Yayz!
Ofcourse. A Kieran/B Ike.
Despite the fact that it ends pretty late, this is indeed her A Support. And then Marcia takes B Kieran, lulz.
Well, Tanith is probably on the frontlines, while Reyson is on the backlines. They won’t be together a lot, so it isn’t a likely support.
A Marcia only.
Zihark and Largo.
I know, I know. Which is exactly why Muarim goes A Zihark/B Largo.
Largo not used much? His offense is wtfmassivepwn. And his durability is also good enough with a Muarim support. And Muarim raepes midgame. Around the time when Largo’s support starts, Muarim’s stats start to decrease compared to other characters. And this boosts his durability and Largo’s much needed durability. B Largo.
He also only needs it lategame, anyway.
And B Largo.
They are only good as Ballista bait. They’re killing almost everything, thus “stealing” experience, which you don’t seem to be a fan of. And there are next to no Ballistae, so it really doesn’t matter a lot. And you can finish chapters within the time limit for full BEXP most of the time anyways.
Muarim is doubling more than enough anyway, and then his Att lead > Tanith’s AS lead. And 1 crit doesn’t make a difference.
Muarim has 16 more HP. 16 HP + Not weak to Bows/Wind > 5 Res + ~10 avoid + Not weak to Fire
Weak to fire > Weak to Bows + Wind
No, Fire Mages/Sages are common. /sarcasm And about the FG, lol @ giving it to Tanith. Jill is better and Marcia is also better, the FG goes to either one of them. Not to Tanith.
Yeah, and this lv 13 Tornado Sage also 3HKO’s Muarim, so that’s not really a problem.
They aim for Generals or Tanith’s Reinforcements anyway. Hmm, something I forgot. They are also useful for baiting long-range magic users. And how common is long-range magic? It’s superwtfmassive rare, just like Ballistae.
Muarim > Tanith this way. 9 Skill + 4 Luck = 20 Hit, which is nullified by Muarim’s weapon. 8 Str > 2 Spd and Muarim’s HP and Defense leads > Tanith’s Resistance lead. Ofcourse, these naked stats aren’t saying much.
Now for real. ??/20 Tanith, A Marcia HP 38.0 Str 20.0 Spd 27.4 Avoid 90.8 Def 17.5 Res 16.0 Mov 9 Silver Lance: Att 37.0 Silver Sword: Att 35.0 ??/20 Muarim, A Zihark/B Largo HP 60.9 Str 27.2 Spd 22.6 Avoid 92.5 Def 20.1 Res 11.5 Mov 9 Claw: Att 36.2
Muarim doesn’t care about being stuck to his Claw. He raepes with it midgame end even lategame he doesn’t really phail with it. And he doesn’t have to care about Weapon Levels and he makes you save money for other weapons. Not that money is a big issue in this game, but still. And then I want to add something else. Why didn’t you say anything about durability? Ah, I know. Because Muarim beats Tanith on durability, winning in everything except for Resistance by 4 points. Haha, lol. Muarim’s massive durability lead > Tanith’s very small offense lead. And to add even more to Muarim’s durability, he can use the terrain to his advantage, which is something Tanith also can’t do.
Now Muarim also beats her on offense. Smart move. /sarcasm
She has 19.8 more avoid? I’d really like to know where you get all your stats from. Muarim is actually winning this by a whopping 2 points. So the only thing Tanith has is 4 Resistance. Lulz. Massive w1n for Muarim. And if you want to be certain that I’m right… Tanith 27.4 * 2 = 54.8 (AS * 2) 54.8 + 21 = 75.8 (AS * 2 + Luck) 75.8 + 15 = 90.8 (AS * 2 + Luck + Supports) Muarim 22.6 * 2 = 45.2 (AS * 2) (Untransformed Spd = 21.1, Transform boost = 3 / 2 = 1.5, 1.5 + 21.1 = 22.6) 45.2 + 14.8 = 60 (AS * 2 + Luck) 60 + 32.5 = 92.5 (AS * 2 + Luck + Supports)
Ah, you mean the one with the falling rocks, right? Send her up the mountain and watch her getting murdered by the enemies there lol.
She has “not-so-good” offense and phail durability. Muarim has good offense and good durability and also has great move. And he can also Shove nearly every character in the game, which is also a good thing. He can even Shove Cavs for gods sake!
Muarim > Tanith, not the other way around. |
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| Zorak | Jan 8 2008, 07:04 AM Post #4 |
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Sure, both have level leads.
So is Muarim, Titania and most pre promotes. Tanith is great mid game and just slightly falls behind compared to other units later on, she is still good. Also how early do you expect her to cap her level? If she is gaining like 1 lvl per chapter she is only capping level like on chapter 28 and therefore a chapter away from the endgame lol, and even still you could just have her around for reinforce and helping Marcia and Reyson get better, furthermore not everyone is reaching 20/20, the fact that she easily can is an advantage.
She gets A Lance early but even without them she has good offense, a Silver Sword has only 2 less mt and she can use it immediately.
K? I mentioned that to prove that Tanith is >>> some of your early units because she doesn’t take as much experience, I wasn’t comparing her with Muarim.
Yep, and increasing her already good offense, most of your units should still be struggling with their weapon level and Tanith has to only worry about one. Tanith Silver Lance lvl 11 C Marcia 31.4 atk, 24.4 AS, 132.7 hit, 9.1 crit 72.1 avo, 32.6 hp, 15.3 def, 13.3 res, 18.3 critavo So with Silver Lance she is already beating Muarim in offense during midgame.
He is getting used, so Tanith gets the support, plus 3 squares is decent range. If you argue that Reyson is busy refreshing people, remember that he has the Knight Ring, refresh and come back, even more move when he is transformed.
The fact that Muarim has to bring a crappy unit to get better is a disadvantage for him. And Largo will get the avoid bonus on afterwards, he has a lot of suckage to overcome. Largo lvl 7 HP 52.0 ATK 21.0 MAG 4.0 SKL 21.0 SPD 20.0 DEF 10.0 RES 3.0 LCK 12.0 He has like 37 atk with a silver axe, good offense? He can hardly double, and the chapter he comes in have Laguz, which he obviously can’t beat, he relies 100% on critical to be able to beat something through the chapters you get him, and will have to steal kill or get fed with BEXP to catch up. His durability is terrible, a melee unit that can’t take the frontlines? He gets like 3HK by everything on the map, and even worse with magic units, the 13 lvl sage I mentioned earlier? Largo gets 2HK by him. Pass.
Like only the Falcon is one rounding things in the early late game, the pegasi are just weakening them and Tanith’s high level makes up for the fact that they are “stealing”, anyway they help you clearing chapters which is the whole point.
Not with the Silver weapons, she has him beat even midgame so Tanith >>> Muarim on offense.
I already mentioned that ballistae aren’t common, and archers aren’t even a problem for the most part since they can hardly do lethal damage, if a Sniper in like lvl 15 was to attack lvl 10 Tanith with a silver bow she would survive it, and at the point of the game she joins you are just starting seeing pre promotes, so not a problem, also the chances for her to dodge are on her side. And wind?! I already proved that she hardly takes damage from it, if you want a more realistic measure instead of a 13 lvl Sage, then a lvl 1 Sage with Elwind, something that should be seen already, does 7 damage to Tanith per hit, wind is hardly a threat. And Muarim lacks durability against his weakness; he will have to stay away from mages seeing as they mostly 3HK him. The same Sage I used just before, if we give him ElFire he 3HKs Muarim. And guess what? This stays true through the whole game, he will have to stay the away from Fire Mages, and even mages hurt him considerably.
He doesn’t fear only Fire Mages/Sages, he fears magic in general.
Why would you give it to Jill ?_? Seeing as she will have like round 20 DEF and 40 HP through the portion of the game we are discussing, and the fact that Archers are less common, she has enough durability to survive on her own. Marcia competes more, but by the time Tanith arrives she is indeed better, so by your logic the FG should go to her.
And? I exaggerated the situation to show that Tanith doesn’t fear wind, give that Sage Bolgagone and he 2HKs Muarim.
They don’t aim for the reinforcements in general unless this is wind, Muarim will have to drain the Fire hit. Long range magic is more common than Ballistae for sure, there’s like three Long range mages on some chapters, chapter 18 has 3, 20 has 2, 23 has like 1-2, 26 have 3 and 28 has 1. And guess what? This is only long range tomes; there are still the sleep staves, the bishops target low res so Muarim is certainly on that list.
Largo isn’t getting used just so Muarim gets better, he sucks on his own and sucks less with Muarim support, and the avoid bonus isn’t reliable enough to matter. Largo on lvl 13 with the B support only has 69.2 avoid, and since the enemies have better hit in this game it won’t matter, his durability still blows. And yes, Tanith is getting the Reyson support. And even still Tanith manages to beat Muarim in offense anyway.
Yes, he does care, maybe mid game it won’t matter but that’s only because everyone has crappy weapons and weapons levels. Late game he looses in offense because he is surpassed by like the whole cast, everyone catches up to his level and gets to use better weapons. And weapon levels >>> being stuck with a 9 mt weapon that only shines in hit.
Lol durability isn’t a problem for Tanith because she isn’t getting hit, midgame she ties in HP and defense with your units so it isn’t bad, Muarim only has an HP lead and like 1 point of defense lead, without mentioning Tanith’s better res. She doesn’t have a problem surviving at all, only important lead is HP which Tanith counters with her avoid and res lead. And apart from having offense lead, she has variety so she has the better offense. Terrain advantage?! More like disadvantage, if you count some crappy bushes that heal like 3 HP per turn lol, and this isn’t FE7 or FE6 where you can hide in forests/mountains and get a ridiculous avo bonus, at the best like +5 avo in FE9 and that still doesn’t make a difference, and this is all without considering how rare the tiles with terrain bonuses are. Also note that Muarim can’t climb mountains as fast as Tanith, penalty lol also he can’t move well in the serenes forest chapter due to swamp, furthermore he falls in the traps of the great bridge, seems to me like a disadvantage
Only did that to show that even with crappy weapons her offense is good.
Lol she is getting the avoid from B Reyson, which is +10% more avoid, thus 100.8. Muarim…only wins if he gets that nonexistent B Largo support and Tanith is without B Reyson. I messed up on like +1 for Muarim AS sorry :psyduk:, he actually has 23.1 with Demi Band, thus 83 avoid, Tanith still wins by 17.8 more avo.
The reinforcements take the bait lol, also that’s one chapter wow. Chapter 18: She is the best candidate to kill the wiverns, flyer + wind sword + 1-2 range she will kill them no doubt. Chapter 19: Nearly required, reinforce will take the ballistae hit while you lure out naesala, plus Tanith can kill the ballistae. Chapter 20: Kill wiverns, go up the mountain and kill the long range mages and save the villages. Chapter 21: Get through the water, she can pretty much get anywhere in no time. Chapter 23: Ballistae bait, and she doesn’t fall in the traps lol, plus she can fly over barriers. Chapter 24: More bait, also she crosses the river and kills the enemies. Chapter 25: Lol you gave a brief example, no ones sending her up immediately and she has the reinforce bait for ballistae and rocks, and because this is a mountain she has the best mobility. Chapter 26: She can go up the mountain and trees. Chapter 28: She can go over the whole forest and get the ravens. Chapter 29: Go up the stairs, walls, fountain etc. Well? Her flier utility is useful in almost every chapter she is in, sure, it isn’t necessary but what is necessary to win this game? Ike lol; flying is still an advantage. Oh and I forgot her mounted bonus, action and move again.
I already proved that her offense is better, if Tanith’s offense is “not-so-good” then Muarim’s must be balls, her durability is good and Muarim only has the HP lead and very small def lead. Great move, flying and mounted bonus >>> Great move. Who cares about shoving? It’s rarely urgent and mounted units have great mov to need to be showed anyway.
Flying utility + Great offense + Good durability + Reinforce >>> Great offense and Great durability Plus this is only Mid game, late game Muarim’s offense falls short. W1nnar = Tanith. |
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| Tino | Jan 10 2008, 02:01 PM Post #5 |
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Muarim’s level lead is slightly larger.
But unlike Titania and other prepromotes, you can’t unequip her for some time and let her just tank. Muarim can tank even without the Demi Band. Titania can always tank, actually. And there are more. If you unequip Tanith she will have a hard time catching up later, since she didn’t gain a couple of levels. It’s easier for Muarim to do this, since he will also transform automatically so that he can act as a tank while untransformed and he can kill when he’s transformed.
If you’re not going to let her cap her level soon, she will have a hard time catching up in stats later on. Muarim attacks half the time and can tank or stay in the back half the time, so that he still gains experience and doesn’t have trouble catching up.
Meh, almost everybody has good offense with silver weapons.
That’s fine with me. But after all, it’s still Muarim vs. Tanith.
But she can’t use a Silver Lance soon enough if you want her to use Silver Swords and let her not do a lot to let other characters gain experience, like you said before.
Meh, w/ever you want then. I’m still not convinced that they support, but okay.
The support start one chapter after Largo joins. And to make up for the “suckage”, you can just give him some BEXP. He is one of the better candidates, since he joins at the lowest level. And if Elincia is also used, then there’s still enough BEXP for Largo, since not everything has to go to Elincia immediately.
So what? Stealing kills doesn’t matter. It doesn’t matter whether Largo or another character kills one particular enemy. And BEXP is also not a problem in this game. There’s more than enough. And lol @ a lot of characters being able to kill Laguz. And also lol @ bad offense. Let’s compare him to somebody who is considered to have incredibly good offense, Boyd. Against Laguz with a Laguz Axe Largo: Att 34 (47) Hit 113 AS 20 Boyd(A Brom/B Titania: Att 42 (55) Hit 121 AS 19 Level 12 Raven HP 39 Spd 21 Def 13 Avoid 45 Largo deals 34 damage at ~80 real hit Boyd deals 42 damage at ~89 real hit Okay, Boyd wins this one, but Largo comes close to killing and he has a decent Crit chance, so I actually don’t see a big gap between them here, while Boyd wins slightly. All the other Laguz aren’t killed by any of them, so Largo wins against them, due to a higher Crit rate. Yeah, lol @ bad offense when you actually bead one of the best fighters of the game.
So what? How many Sages are there actually. And why would Largo have to take them on? Ofcourse it’s not good that he has low Resistance, but he doesn’t suffer from it. And he also completely pwns the amount of lance users in the game, so that’s also not a problem at all.
You started with the stealing thing, but w/ever. The point is that you want your other characters to gain as much experience as possible and you don’t want ballistae bait to take away this valuable experience.
Like I said above, she’s not gaining Silver Lances fast. And if you want to level Tanith slowly, which you were talking about, then she isn’t really gaining a lot of experience while Muarim keeps gaining experience, increasing his level lead. So, by the time Tanith would’ve gained something like 2 levels, Muarim already gained 4 or something, which increases the level gap and this gives Muarim the advantage in stats.
Sure, but that doesn’t take her weakness to them away. And that way Muarim also isn’t taking damage from Sages because he’s also avoiding nearly everything. Then you get 16 HP > 5 Res + ~10 avoid + Weak to Wind
‘K then. But still 16 HP > 5 Res + ~10 Avoid
Watch how Muarim avoids all those fire spells and then come back again.
Not since he’s avoiding most attacks.
Marcia is better, but since Tanith is avoiding more, she wants the FG more than Tanith.
??/20 Muarim, A Zihark/B Largo HP 60.9 Spd 22.6 Avoid 92.5 Res 11.5 This Sage of you deals 25 damage once at ~2 true hit. So that Sage doesn’t even 2HKO him, like you said, and also nearly never hits. Lulz.
Long-range magic has sligthly lower Hit, so those Mages will have a hard time hitting Muarim, let alone killing him.
Largo has WTA most of the time, so then his Avoid already raises to 84.2 and if he’s up against Axe users, he also doesn’t really fear getting hit because axe users seem to have sorta low hit. And let’s just stop this useless “support battle” and just give Tanith A Marcie/B Reyson and Muarim A Zihark/B Largo. If you don’t agree, fine, but then this useless discussion will just continue.
Is that a bad thing? No.
It’s pretty nice that he doesn’t have to care about weapon levels. He can use all his possible weapons (lol, 1) all the time while others can’t, including Tanith. Plus, midgame is considered harder than lategame, so it’s good that he’s completely raeping there.
Muarim isn’t getting hit either.
Haha, having the better durability against the majority of enemies > having the better durability against the rarest amount of enemies, which Muarim also is good against.
Since Muarim is also avoiding everything, that lead is insignificant. So it’s basically Large amount of HP + Small amount of Defense vs. Some Resistance. Muarim w1ns.
Tanith climbing the mountain quickly probably results in Tanith ending up dead. And I only mentioned terrain because that increases Muarim’s durability lead.
With a Steel Lance she really isn’t killing.
Tanith has Reyson so Muarim has Largo. It’s as easy as that. And okay, Tanith has an avoid lead. Nice. Muarim avoids everything anyway. And if one of them actually gets hit, Muarim completely pwns Tanith on durability.
That sword is going to Mist and nobody else. Tanith doesn’t use it.
Ofcourse.
She’s only doing that with the Sonic Sword, which she doesn’t get.
Nice, really nice. So you’re sending her there alone? Haha.
If you know where the traps are, it doesn’t matter a lot anyway.
Oh ofcourse. Like Muarim isn’t killing.
*points at all other fliers*
What mountain are you talking about?
Couple o’ enemies aren’t making a big difference.
The only one that’s somewhat important here is the fountain, which she’s not flying over because she’s gonna get smashed by some dragons then. The others don’t matter at all because you could easily move to the same spot by NOT flying over the trees etc.
Not when it’s not even that useful in most chapters. If flying is that big of an advantage then Terrain Bonuses are, too.
I only said it to tell how good he was at shoving. And shoving is actually quite useful. He’s even the best candidate for Smite since Mordi already has it. If he has Smite he also isn’t useless when he’s untransformed. *idea* Now he doesn’t even need the Demi Band and when he transforms he even gains better boosts so that he pwns Tanith.
Lategame, Tanith’s offense lags behind too. Muarim’s offense and durability are slightly better than Tanith’s, so that makes Muarim better. Plus, the fact that he can gain full bonuses while still being useful also is not a bad thing. Muarim >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Muarim > Tanith |
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| Zorak | Jan 11 2008, 08:48 AM Post #6 |
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He comes like at lvl 9 when your units are starting to promote, he might gain like two levels between the chapters, if anything the lead is like 1 lvl larger.
… You only need tanking on the early game, where pretty much everyone is weak. Late game why would you tank ?_? Everyone is strong enough to take care of most enemies, you wouldn’t need it unless you are babying someone, plus Muarim can’t “tank” effectively due to the transformation, he gains like +1 to the transform gauge every time he is getting attacked. Plus taking the demi band from him just so he can drain some hits = fail.
How is she capping her level soon? And what is “soon” to you? Like chapter 25? Lol she won’t be capping her level soon unless you have her take like all the kills and stuff her with BEXP, realistically she should be getting a level up per chapter or something like that, where as to she will reach it on chapter 28, already mentioned. Plus you can dump her in the final chapter in like lvl 15 and she will be doing well, she still has reinforce, Marcia and Reyson. In lvl 15 her stats are only like 2 points lower than on lvl 20 so there is no problem even is she is leveling slowly.
What’s your point ?_? That he can be useful and catch up? I mentioned twice that Tanith isn’t capping her level “soon” unless you baby her…which she doesn’t need; plus “tanking” isn’t necessary nor useful in late game and this is all without mentioning reinforce. Reinforce >>> Tanking
Which Muarim can’t get. Plus remember this is mid game, people are like on lvl 3-5 after promotion, they won’t be able to use silver weapons if they are leveling their other weapons.
She only needs to double 15 enemies with a steel lance to raise her level to A, if she doesn’t kill she will be gaining like 6-15 exp per round, if she does kill she is getting like 11-21 exp per round, so if anything, she will be getting A in lances like on chapter 20; so if we consider her killing everything she will only be gaining like 2 level ups till she gets A lances.
Sure, but measuring her with other units and getting an advantage is still +points for her, even if the comparison isn’t Muarim.
K if we are putting an end to the support argument, Largo’s suck is still present, plus even with the bonuses it is a disadvantage for Muarim to need him.
…So for Muarim to get better he needs to bring a crappy unit that will be taking most of the BEXP from the team, big – for Muarim there. And how does joining with a low level make you a better candidate for BEXP? Joining with a low level means you need babying, not a better candidate, let’s have Rolf suck the whole BEXP and everyone goes to hell!
And how does stealing kills not matter? Not one rounding for Largo = fail. For the most part one wants to share the BEXP for the team, and Mist/Marcia/Nephenee are most likely to need the BEXP, so there is never really a part were everyone will be copping fine + gaining lots of BEXP. Yes, there is a decent amount, but that is only if we are using it moderately, not for Largo to suck it dry.
That…wasn’t the point, I was saying that Largo can’t grow quickly because of the laguz, his joining chapter is bad for him, plus the rocks and ballistae means he is likely to be crippled.
Lol offense isn’t measured only by how much damage you deal per hit. Also you set the enemy up so it only depended on one hit since it has good speed. Guess what? Againts the same Raven with a Laguz Lance. Tanith: Att 32 (44) Hit 145.6 AS 27.4 So with the defence applied she deals 31 damage, but OMG she double attacks, so therefore she has better offense than Largo. A character needs to have 26 AS to double that enemy, so sure Largo can deal one powerful hit and beat most, the problem with Largo is his crappy AS. An enemy needs 16 AS for Largo to double him lol, furthermore this is at the point of the game where everyone has more speed than Largo, plus his meh hit without supports = conclusion, Largo has bad offense.
Mages with fire magic can take care of them easy enough, Tanith herself with the flame lance is deals like 28 damage, plus better avoid and AS.
Wth how exactly doesn’t he suffer from it? If he has to watch out for magic that harness his freedom, and on chapter 26 there’s…3 long range sages, remember that long range magic has more mt than the A level tome so Largo eats a good amount of damage…also remember long range staves; Largo gets destroyed by magic. Lance users? Even with the extra avoid, which you yourself mentioned raises to 84.2 with WTA, enemies have good hit, 84.2 avo isn’t that reliable to send him on the frontlines, the enemies still deal good damage to him, like potentially round 18 physical damage.
They won’t be bait every chapter, also remember that like only one is bait and there is also the chance that the Pegasi might dodge. And how much exp do you think they are taking? You make it sound like if they are taking like 20% of all the kills, if anything, they will be taking like 5% or less, which isn’t a considerable change.
Wth I addressed this point like 4 times already. Gaining like 1 level per chapter is close to average, all your characters will be gaining 1-2 levels per chapter, so Tanith is levelling normally. Lol the level lead is something that is supposed to close eventually, not raise. Tanith gains 2 levels in 2 chapters, so Muarim is getting 2 levels per chapter?! Only if you have him take lots of kills, which is stealing the “valuable experience”, furthermore if you follow that pattern he caps his level on chapter 22, even before Largo joins lol, keep using him and there goes your valuable exp.
That’s a simple way to look at it, remember that Tanith, apart from dodging more, has 1-2 range so if you want she won't be attacked on the player phase, also she has a good control over the WT since she can use swords and lances, which means more avoid, something that Muarim can’t do.
…Using that same 13 lvl Sage again, he has…136 hit, there’s like 50% chance that he might get hit, so it isn’t reliable enough, also this is assuming Muarim is at full level against a lvl 13 Sage, which won’t happen.
Above.
:richie: You claimed that the better one got the FG, but now the weaker one gets it ?_? When Tanith joins Tanith is indeed better than her.
Okay…? That was a comparison with a lvl 11 Muarim, not lvl 20, which is in fact a 2HK, also lvl 11 Muarim has 58.9 avo even with B Zihark, lol at him dodging it always.
We all know that they don’t kill him, but they deal decent damage to him, also the hit is like -15% compared to the others, a sage in the same level as Muarim should have 50% or more hit.
Sure about the support battle, but like addressed above Largo’s suck matters. I already proved that his avoid isn’t anything special even with WTA advantage applied, nor is it reliable. Warriors have like 30-40% to him sure; problem is enemies have a level lead on him, and for the most part his avoid is not good enough, also note that this is once he gets the B support. At the start he will be stuck with sub par avoid and will be struggling immensely to catch up, he starts of with…52 avoid lol.
Wth Tanith gets the silver sword immediately, that >>> claw, also a steel lance has more mt than a claw lol. Muarim isn’t for the majority of the mid game, more like the ending of it, and only two chapters away from Tanith, he only raeps for a short time before others catch up to him.
…Yes he is, or at least more so than Tanith.
Lol he can’t even counter them, how is he good against them? And they aren’t that “rare” at all. Also considering that when talking about the physical enemies it’s HP against her avoid, she isn’t getting hit for the most part. Also remember that late game Tanith gets the Runesword, which HEALS every time you hit an enemy, that >>> the HP lead Muarim has. “But Mist gets it” Mist is unlikely to get the Runesword, first off, it is the heaviest sword without counting Alondite and Ragnell, so if Mist is at 20/20 she will be 3 points slower. Furthermore Mist has crap skl, like 14 on average…the runesword has 65 hit, she will be having trouble with that. And this is considering Mist being at 20/20.
lolwtf Muarim isn’t avoiding everything at all, no one can avoid everything, but for the most part Tanith is avoiding more that Muarim, the fact that 10% or even 17% avo lead is insignificant is stupid. Runesword >>> Muarim’s HP lead. Also Tanith has WTA control, which gives more avoid.
Wth are you talking about, no one is making Tanith climb the mountain quickly when there’s a bunch of enemies at the top. The terrain increase is like 5+ avo lol and rare as hell, I prefer having good mobility all the time that having it cut by swamp and other terrain and gaining a crappy and rare +5 avo.
Yes she is, she doubles more.
…………….. lol Muarim isn’t avoiding everything, I don’t know what makes you say that with inferior avoid, if he dodges everything then Tanith is untouchable. And if they get hit, Muarim is getting hit moar so the lead is not big at all, plus late game you get the runesword and Tanith has the WT control.
Lol oki, so your Mist had B in swords when Tanith joined, you practically got her pregnant with BEXP then. Tanith gets to use it for having better magic that all physical units, she isn’t going to break it, she gets the flame lance later on and remember there is still hammerne for the wind sword.
Above.
Lol she has reinforce bait plus isn’t targeted by sleep staves, she has mounted bonus AND 1-2 range. She can hit and run while your units take care of the right side enemies, did I mention that Marcia goes with her?
It does because some block paths that get you to the other side quicker, Tanith just flies over the traps and sacks, while everyone has to go around.
Not if he can’t reach them as quickly, that isn’t the point.
Okay…? Marcia, Haar and Jill have it as well, your point? That doesn’t make her worse.
Next to the paladin and wiverns there is a hill, so she can kill the wiverns and move left instantly over the hill, check the map plzkthx.
Awesome so the EXP reinforce takes won’t make a difference as well. 
Not really, there’s ledges around the fountain, who can move over them, hit and run? Tanith.
Wth flying is an advantage and I already showed it is useful, Terrain bonuses are clearly not because of their rarity, plus subpar bonuses.
Shove can help, but is not too useful, like the only time you need it is for recruiting Astrid, that’s about it.
Lol k so he is really loosing badly in usefulness, the boosts, if anything, will be roughly like a 2+ for strength and 1+ for spd and skl 2+ for Def and Res, comparing with demi band Muarim. If you are making him fight even less that he is so he can shove then Tanith is clearly beating Muarim in every aspect. He also looses on mov.
They both lag, but Tanith has the better offense due to much better weapons and more AS. Durability only lies on like HP and very tiny Def lead vs Avoid plus Res, you act like if Muarim has a huge lead on it. And no, shoving for better bonuses but hardly fighting isn’t a good idea. Her durability problems are fixed when she get’s the runesword, so Tanith >>> Muarim in every aspect. Great offense + Great durability + Flying and mounted bonus+ Reinforce >>>>>>>> Muarim’s mid game durability lead, lol at shoving. |
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, he actually has 23.1 with Demi Band, thus 83 avoid, Tanith still wins by 17.8 more avo.| « Previous Topic · Debate Challenges · Next Topic » |
8:08 AM Nov 27
