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| Where do we stand? | |
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| Topic Started: Jan 13 2008, 05:13 PM (715 Views) | |
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Jan 13 2008, 05:13 PM Post #1 |
Fuck You
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What if Martin Luther King, Jr. could see us now? What if Jesus (A) could see us now? What if Muhammad (S) could see us now? What if the greatest people of mankind could see us now? Where do we stand in the topic of morality and respect today? I have been watching boondocks lately, and its more than a comedy. Its more than a t.v. show, its a satire representing a large number of the population of America. This topic is largely in response to the following video: http://youtube.com/watch?v=M0Imhdpo9ss After watching that, I wondered why there I was in a guild/group called da_niggaz online. |
  
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| Crysta | Jan 13 2008, 05:37 PM Post #2 |
yay for conformity!
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I did more than one book report on MLK in grade school lol. I'm not an expert or anything, but I think he was worried about the black community before he was martyred. Not everyone wanted peaceful marches and that disturbed him, which makes the riots following his assassination very tragic. I'm pretty confident that he wouldn't be that blunt, but in general that episode depicts him well I think. In it he's considered more of an iconic figure more than someone who is taken to heart, as he is during our time. I don't think he'd be happy with how the black community has shaped-up, and he'd be expecting more out of them than they may want. They might be more willing to listen to him than Bill Cosby, though. As for Jesus... I think he'd just be dismayed in general without knowing where to start. He so wouldn't touch politics. 
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~ Crysta, Zombie Queen
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Jan 13 2008, 05:52 PM Post #3 |
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Fuck You
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The series does contain a large amount of stereotypes based on the majority of the people's characters of today. Some privileges and rights today are looked upon as they were always there. Some people speak on behalf of MLK today, but I see their words as matter without substance. |
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| Grady | Jan 13 2008, 06:54 PM Post #4 |
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Kimichi, we're not a real organization. We're just a bunch of teenagers who joke around on an internet forum. Until someone is truly offended by that, then we'll stop. But no one is, because they can tell the difference between a joke and malice. I'm sure MLK would be proud to see an African-American candidate running for president, with a legitimate chance at winning. I'm sure he'd also be proud to see the strives our culture has made. But then there's still plenty of negatives. The fact that Barack Obama being black is a problem still means we have a long way to go. When people are thought of as people, then I'm sure he'd be happy, but they're not. And, in my opinion, they never will be. The Boondocks is made BY a black person. It was originally a comic made BY a black person and directed at black people. It isn't trivializing black culture, it's embracing it, and actually has messages that you're obviously failing to see. It's REAL, and that's the truth. It isn't an exaggeration, it's real. If anything, the white people in the show are exaggerated as a joke. Riley represents the Hip Hop influenced young black child, while Huey represents the intellectual that kids should strive to be. Until you've been around black people, you can't say the show is racist. You have retards like Al Sharpton preaching against it, but the word "nigga" is a common part of black culture and language. That's just the way it is. |
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| Cephas | Jan 13 2008, 07:03 PM Post #5 |
Dies Irę , Dies ilia; Solvet sęclum in favilla
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Jesus would be most dissatisfied, and I think he is dissatisfied since he is the Son of God. He said no divorce. People are divorcing. Only the Catholic Church upholds the no divorce dogma nowadays... No Adultery...- underage sex is rampant due to parents being chumps when it comes to discipline. Marrying another person while the person you divorced is still alive is also adultery. Corresponding Bible passages for divorce are Matthew 5; 31-32. Matthew 19; 3-9. Mark 10. 1 Corinithians 7. Douay-Rhiems translation. Humane Vitae, written by Pope Paul VI, is related to this as well. Murder(Fifth commandment) - Abortion counts as ending a human being's life, whether or not the organism is capable of rational thought; EVERY person was once a "blob of tissue", including Jesus. First Commandment-(Thou shalt not have other gods besides Me) - Definitely not being upheld, even bishops are not upholding this Honor thy mother and father - ... Prayer to God denied in schools - Well, he is God, a part of the Trinity...it's obvious. Also, he established a visible church with Peter as the foundation. Now, only the Catholic Church has the strong historical backing for the claim that it is the Church he established(Aquinas was Catholic, his writing on the 7 Sacrements is proof enough). Of course, everyone is taught to hate that church nowadays, and even some people within the church do not wish to follow him. |
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I do not like fools. Mozart's music is hax. Formerly: Voltaire FEs I've played and how much I like them. 1. FE4 2. FE6 3. FE8, FE3 4. FE7 5. FE5(I don't like it at all). Salve, Regina, mater misericordiae: vita, dulcedo, et spes nostra, salve. Ad te clamamus exsules filii Hevae. Ad te suspiramus, gementes et flentes in hac lacrimarum valle. Eia, ergo, advocata nostra, illos tuos misericordes oculos ad nos converte. Et Iesum, benedictum fructum ventris tui, nobis post hoc exsilium ostende. O clemens, O pia, O dulcis Virgo Maria. Amen. St. Michael the Archangel, defend us in battle; be our safeguard against the wickedness and snares of the Devil. May God rebuke him, we humbly pray, and do Thou, O Prince of the Heavenly Host, by the power of God, cast into Hell, Satan and all the other evil spirits, who wander throughout the world, seeking the ruin of souls. Amen. | |
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| +Reaver | Jan 13 2008, 07:52 PM Post #6 |
Troll
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I loathe the Catholic Church's philosophy: "break, not bend." Looking back upon history, the Catholic Church has, time after time, willingly disregarded evidence and studies to further themselves and protect their dogma. Jesus wasn't a person who believed in a rigid social order, as seen in his various run-ins with pharasees and sadducces, why should an organization founded by Jesus be so damn rigid? Standards from 2000+ years ago won't easily apply today, especially with changes in society. I would imagine Jesus would be happy with those trying to live a decent life, albeit contradictory to the Bible. With that in mind...Because marriages and relationships are all the same and no one should break their vows due to circumstances such as spousal abuse and infidelity, right? I'm going to argue context here. Back in the time period Jesus was alive, marriage was a social and financial necessity for a woman. A man throwing a woman out of his house meant she would literally die without a husband because she couldn't hold a job, couldn't support herself, and would be forced to beg unless a man took her as his wife. Jesus, when saying that one shall not divorce, said this to protect women from abusive, manipulative husbands rather than to uphold marriage in and of itself. Ask your parents what age they were when they were married. Ask your grandparents what age they were when they were married. You might see that your grandparents were hitched earlier than your grandparents. Back in the day in Jerusalem, it wasn't uncommon for girls to get married at fourteen. Now, pair that with women hitting puberty at a younger age nowadays and you'll see something: the gap between sexual maturity and marriage has increased by at least a decade in some scenarios. Rather than waiting, say, six months to have sex with your husband many girls wait 13 years to have sex with their husband. Context of historical times is key in arguing the Bible. Every person was once a "blob of tissue," but was every "blob of tissue" once a person? Jesus wouldn't approve of this. This one is just flat-out wrong. You can pray to God in school if you want, you may pray as much as you like, but an organization cannot force one to pray because of differing religious views. I can see why a lot of people look at the church negatively, it only expects people to give and give to them despite how they're outdated rules aren't helping Americans today live spiritual lives because they're ridiculously outdated. |
Favorite Staffer Summer 2008 -- Send me a Personal Message | |
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| Cephas | Jan 13 2008, 11:25 PM Post #7 |
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Dies Irę , Dies ilia; Solvet sęclum in favilla
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Mosaic Law had its rigid standards, even without the meddling of the Pharisees. Jesus never preached against the then 1000+ year old Ten Commandments, he reaffirmed them as dogma even then. He still told a man he healed to perform a offering according the Old Law as well since it was still in effect. As he himself stated in Matthew 5; 17, "Do not think that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets. I am not come to destroy, but to fulfill". Once fulfilled, he will establish a New Covenant (Jerimiah 31; 31). Anyone can infer that this Covenant will be like the old, in that it must be followed in all that is prescribed by God by those who choose to follow it. The fact that he voluntary accepted all the sufferings inflicted upon him just so that this Covenant can be established helps testifies to his Divine origins. And in the end, Even with this context you proposed, it's still contradicting what He preached on marriage, and no one likes being contradicted, especially God. The statements remain unambiguous when read even within context of the biblical passages, such as in the following:
A pair is allowed to separate from another in case of fornication, as said in the Bible by Jesus, but they aren't permitted to remarry as long as their former spouse still lives. The bond is still not broken until death separates them, however, as quoted in post above this quote. Hence, it cannot be divorce per se, as divorce is a complete dissolution of the bond of marriage.Also, if the death of the spouse is obtained through his/her former partner's murder of him, one will most likely go to Hell, as the Fifth Commandment is broken if when that action is executed, but that should be obvious. Also, Jesus came as Savior, King, and Prophet. Yes, he is a king of a kingdom that is not of this world, but it's obvious that an king would establish a visible institution where the followers accepts all of His teachings like those who faithfully followed Mosaic law, not just pick and choose some things according to one's own pleasure and then discard the rest. He Himself that he was "King of the Jews", but of course, not everyone accepted Him. Those who did revered him as their King and their followers, ideally, would be taught likewise. These are the Christians. The Pharisees were hypocritical, yes, but Jesus said to those who listened to their preaching to do what they say to you in their sermons, but don't do what they actually do, which is contradictory to what they preach.
The fertilized egg has all the genetic info need to develop into a functional human being capable of rational thought, but they it is simply being denied the ability to do so, it's as simple as that. They are denied the ability to live. The voluntary killing of offspring is contrary to nature. Even the animals will defend their young to the bitter end if necessary, but we humans are so pathetic that we can't? Third, I'm living in this world, learning stuff, etc, why should I deny that to my fellow man? Fourth, if said statment were applied in the months while I, or anyone else for that matter, was still in my mother's womb, the implication is that I would've been perfectly suitable for slaughter. No one who has still has a conscience would dare kill a baby, but just a few months prior to that during a pregnancy, it's perfectly fine?
All I was saying was that the the ban on prayers to God be lifted. I did not propose any counter-legislation in which the institution mandates prayer.
Yes, and he still would not approve of idolterers, or anyone else who reject Him and what he taught, in part or in full. Anyway, if he didn't create a visible church, there would be no Bible to perserve what he did in writing. The Bible's Canon was even closed until approximately 400 years after his death. Just to put that into perspective, the U.S is only about 231.6 years old. None of your points convincingly counters the fact that Jesus would not be happy with the world in its current state, because your points contradict his points. All Ten Commandments are not being upheld, from the first to the last, by many in this present time and his other teachings aren't faring well either. His supposed dissatisfaction is supported by his own words yet again, this time John 14; 21: "He that hath my commandments, and keepeth them; he it is that loveth me. And he that loveth me, shall be loved of my Father: and I will love him, and will manifest myself to him." Really, I can't see how can he even be slightly optimistic with current trends, much less happy. Now, if you want a pre-Vatican II and post-Council of Trent Catechism of what Catholic laymen were/are supposed to be fed, here's one by Pope St. Pius X. http://www.catholicapologetics.info/thechu...chism/PIUSX.DOC ------ Note: The Douay Rhiems Bible was the official Bible used by English-speaking Catholics before the Confraternity version. |
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I do not like fools. Mozart's music is hax. Formerly: Voltaire FEs I've played and how much I like them. 1. FE4 2. FE6 3. FE8, FE3 4. FE7 5. FE5(I don't like it at all). Salve, Regina, mater misericordiae: vita, dulcedo, et spes nostra, salve. Ad te clamamus exsules filii Hevae. Ad te suspiramus, gementes et flentes in hac lacrimarum valle. Eia, ergo, advocata nostra, illos tuos misericordes oculos ad nos converte. Et Iesum, benedictum fructum ventris tui, nobis post hoc exsilium ostende. O clemens, O pia, O dulcis Virgo Maria. Amen. St. Michael the Archangel, defend us in battle; be our safeguard against the wickedness and snares of the Devil. May God rebuke him, we humbly pray, and do Thou, O Prince of the Heavenly Host, by the power of God, cast into Hell, Satan and all the other evil spirits, who wander throughout the world, seeking the ruin of souls. Amen. | |
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| Sentenal | Jan 14 2008, 12:04 AM Post #8 |
When you can't make them see the light, make them feel the heat.
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Reaver, do you honestly think that Jesus would be fine with people living "decent" lives, but contrary to the bible? Contrary to his teachings? How could you POSSIBLY say that? Did Jesus not say the only way to the Father, is through him? If someone is living their life contrary to his own teachings, then he wouldn't be happy. He would be grieved. All sin the the eyes of the Father, regardless of how big or small we see them as, are equal. If people are living in sin/against his teachings, no matter if they are "decent" to your standards, it is sin. Jesus wouldn't be happy with the current state of the world, but I don't think he would be surprised. |
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| +Reaver | Jan 14 2008, 10:46 AM Post #9 |
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Troll
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Yes, I do. So an Astronaut that donates to charity organizations and studies the earth's rotation is going to hell because he believes two things that contradict the Bible: the earth revolves around the sun and the moon is a lesser light (it merely reflects sunlight). Also, let's take everyone who doesn't follow dietary laws or chooses not to get circumcised: they are all going to hell regardless of their benign nature and good deeds because they aren't living by the book. I am a firm believer that the Bible is outdated. I would call technilogical growth exponential. Electricity is a relatively recent concept, airplanes are even more recent and look at our development of the internet. This also doesn't answer why modern day religions have selectively read and chose to disregard dietary laws and other Old Testament traditions that "no longer apply." That's a divorce; Catholic Churches refuse to marry men or women going into a second marriage if their former significant other still lives. He did pick and choose some regarding to his pleasure; where the hell did the practice of dietary laws go? Why don't we believe everything revolves around the earth? Why do people work on Sundays? Why are blue laws slowly disappearing across the United States? This doesn't address the point that Jesus wasn't a fan of a rigid social order... What ability to live? Life is defined by specific criteron that a fetus cannot meet. I'll quote an old argument I typed up the last time abortion came up:
Your fellow fetus isn't alive. It's comparable to the difference of throwing a rock and a baby off of a cliff. One is alive, one is not. Arguing that a fetus is alive is foolish because, by the criterion set for living, a fetus is not alive. The legislation you talk about doesn't exist. You mean a Bible written after his life by a significant amount of time and we didn't have any text before Jesus to show us how to live a holy life? The Church is irrelevant to living a spiritual life, why should I give into a secular power which can merely claim to represent a higher power in order to love Jesus and love my God? Wait, Jesus's commandments were "Love your neighbor as you love yourself" and "Love your God" correct? I'm pretty sure that most people, even if they don't follow all of the teachings in the Bible. (Source: Mark 12:28-34, Matthew 22:34-40 and Luke 10:25-28) |
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| +Ema Skye | Jan 14 2008, 02:58 PM Post #10 |
Snackoos = <3. It's science!
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The Gospels were written long after Jesus's death, and they were not even written by the people that supposedly said those things. His true teachings, as far as I can tell, are lost and/or changed to suit the desires of those in power in the religion. As for the initial post, I think MLK would be pretty disappointed in the black community. White people aren't even the "enemy" anymore; blacks have become their own worst enemies when it comes to progressing in society and moving up the social ladder. Jesus wouldn't be surprised; he's supposedly up in Heaven watching us, no? |
 MUNCH MUNCH MUNCH MUNCH MUNCH MUNCH MUNCH 
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| Sentenal | Jan 14 2008, 06:19 PM Post #11 |
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When you can't make them see the light, make them feel the heat.
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Where the hell does Jesus teach anything about the Sun or Moon? Where does Jesus teach that if you don't follow the dietary laws, you are going to hell? He DIDN'T.
Uhhh, yes they were. o_O The Book of John, for example, was written by one of his Disciples (John). Look, if you want to start saying the Bible has had things alter/changed/none of it is what it was, I got some reading material for you: http://debate.org.uk/topics/history/bib-qur/bibmanu.htm http://debate.org.uk/topics/history/bib-qur/bibdoc.htm http://debate.org.uk/topics/history/bib-qur/bibarch.htm Basically, this is a compariative study between the Bible and the Quran, seeing which has more evidence in terms of manuscripts, documentation, and archeological stuff. I don't mean to post this link as to start a Christianity vs Islam tangent (which might happen now, I guess), I just post it to show you that the Bible has strong evidence in terms of historical documents behind it. |
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| +Reaver | Jan 14 2008, 06:46 PM Post #12 |
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Troll
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Your point was: "Reaver, do you honestly think that Jesus would be fine with people living "decent" lives, but contrary to the bible?" While the example of orbits was a Catholic Church thing, the story of creation in Genesis discusses how God created two lights, the greater to rule the day (the sun) and the lesser to rule the night (the moon). That's fairly contrary to the Bible to believe the moon reflects light from the sun and nothing more. If we're talking strictly about Jesus, I 100% agree that we only need two commandments because those two commandments are universal and will, unless our future is weird, never be outdated or found obsolete. |
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Jan 14 2008, 07:02 PM Post #13 |
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Fuck You
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I didn't say the show was racist, and I didn't say the show was fake. I admit the white people are exaggerated on the show. But the black people in the show are a reflection of whats mostly happening today. What MLK said in the episode represents the culture of good and bad contained in the black society. I see the black community mostly being divided into two stereotype categories. Which are Athletes and Gangsters, and most gangsters believe they will not pass the age of 20 or 30. Boondocks is simply a message of what black people should be through the eyes of Huey. The setting also describes the standards that should be reached. The word "nigger" was a racial slur that used to be used. And it probably is still used in secrecy today by other races. The fact that "nigga" has some what resembles the racial slur. But is the word "nigga" the choice of words MLK wanted black people to create? |
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| Sentenal | Jan 14 2008, 07:29 PM Post #14 |
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When you can't make them see the light, make them feel the heat.
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No, that was not my point.
There is all of my point. It isn't good form to cut out parts. According to the bible, if you have Jesus as your Lord and Savior, and follow his teachings, you will be saved from Hell. If you do not, then you will damn yourself to hell via your own sins. This is the very core of Christianity. This is something that does not change with the times. Jesus would NOT be happy with someone living a "good/decent" life, but against his teachings. |
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| +Reaver | Jan 14 2008, 07:34 PM Post #15 |
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Troll
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And Jesus, as a jew, would've taught the torah (Old Testament) correct? |
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5:46 AM Nov 27
