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| Merk vs Inui | |
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| Topic Started: Jan 16 2008, 11:17 PM (216 Views) | |
| +Ema Skye | Jan 16 2008, 11:17 PM Post #1 |
Snackoos = <3. It's science!
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You're opening. Lance vs Percival, I do believe. I hope you're still first tier, because then this will be really fun. |
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| Merk | Jan 20 2008, 03:28 PM Post #2 |
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ザワザワ
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I can't promise anything, but let's have a good match. Lance and Percival are both elite units. A rational player on an optimizing run (ranking, full completion) would most likely use both paladins. So, my argument will not be about how Lance "deserves" to be on the team and Percival "doesn't deserve" his spot, but rather that removing Lance from the team will have a higher marginal cost than removing Percival (removing Lance will do more harm to your overall efforts in an optimized run). In Lance's favor, he has ~12 chapters to develop supports. Ideally, he has A Alan and C Clarine. A Alan is obvious, and Alan is also a high-powered unit that will remain in play. Clarine is a good choice as an excellent mage and healer and matches Lance's movement. Lance's presence helps Alan's HIT and Clarine's EVA. Since Alan will initially struggle to hit enemies, Lance's support makes him that much more effective. Clarine recieving bonus EVA is important as her physical defense is meager. Against Lance is that he requires an investment of 1 Knight's Crest to change classes; the crest could instead be kept unused to bolster the funds ranking. Other uses for the Knight's crest aren't attractive: promoting Noah, Treck, Wendy, Bors, or Barth. In Percival's favor, he maintains strong statistics and weapon levels, outclassing Lance in raw comparison (this may not hold for the duration of the game, but Percival is obviously stronger when he first arrives). Against Percival is that he has few decent support partners; Cecilia and Douglas are out as they have subpar stats. Elphin and Lalum are decent choices, but generally you want your bard/dancer near your most powerful strike unit to maximize your team's offensive potential per turn. Percival, while very balanced and powerful, isn't the best strike unit. Miredy, Rutger, and Gonzales are all examples of superior strike units, as are most mages given a general lack of RES among enemies (Even if Elph/Lal don't support many strikers, they're better utilized that way). Klein is a good support option, but isn't generally useful outside of chapters with many dragon knights. Removing Lance has the costs of: 1. Losing Lance, an elite unit that anyone would use 2. Making Alan less effective 3. Making Clarine less effective (Alternatively, Roy) Removing Lance has the benefits of: 1. Retaining one Knight's Crest for Funds Removing Percival has the costs of: 1. Losing Percival Removing Percival has benefits of: 1. Making Elphin or Lalum available to other, more offensive-oriented units Unless a player is struggling with Funds, it seems Lance is the more valuable unit. |
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~AKA SkyFireZero. a r p s | |
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| +Ema Skye | Jan 20 2008, 04:37 PM Post #3 |
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Snackoos = <3. It's science!
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Yes, let's.
Both units are top tier, so anyone that cares about not only ranks, but just pwning in general, will use them. Interesting approach. Let's see how much good it does.
A Alan is certainly a given. However, C Clarine won't be happening since both units prefer the speed and bonuses of other partners. Lance wants Atk a lot more than Def, and Roy, a unit forced in every chapter, desperately needs him. Roy offers full Atk instead of partial Atk, which Lance likes more for one-rounding things. Clarine needs full Crit over partial Atk, so she'll be taking Rutger and Dieck. The difference between her killing and not killing won't be decided by 1 Atk since her Atk is already atrocious; she needs a Crit very often, and Rutger and Dieck will give her +25 Crit. The most optimal B for Lance, in terms of benefiting both the team and himself, would be Roy.
It's not just that he requires it, but it's the most sought after promotional item in the game. Treck and Noah are far from horrible, and Alan is a stellar unit that needs the Spd promoting would give him. Lance not only costs you 10,000 Gold in weapons/Funds to promote, but he may end up costing even more since you'll have to buy the crest from the secret shop in Chapter 16 sometimes. Percival costs less in every regard; he costs less money by a lot since he doesn't promote and can main axes from the start, and he consumes far less EXP by joining at a higher level. Every kill Lance got in the earlygame could have been used on another unit to make them better. Albeit the negativity of that is extremely minimal, it's still worth noting that Percival's massive level means he consumes far less EXP and lets other units get more.
Percival's raw stats are far better for the entire game. Lance's only hope is to outperform him in offense based on supports.
Percival's supports are indeed his weakness, but he has enough options to ensure that he has partners. Percival's largest weakness is Hit, and his Dark affinity will offer partial to full Hit regardless. If he takes Klein or the bard/dancer you have, he will recieve full Hit, and full Evd to make his durability go from amazing to infinite. Klein has many positives that are worth noting. He doesn't need a promotional item, he starts off very strong, and he has a very strong support list that included Rutger, Clarine, Dieck, Tate, and Percival. Considering the value of not taking counters when he attacks, the abundance of fliers, and that he'd actually counter enemies in Sacae, his bow-usage can indeed be a boon for your team. As for Douglas and Cecilia, both are quite usable. Cecilia's problem is that she is very slow, but she has the benefits of a mount, not taking counters when she attacks, an EXP boost built into her class, and the usage of high level staves. Cecilia x Douglas x Percival can actually be a strong triangle. Also, Roy needs a C support, and Cecilia can give that to him easily. Douglas has nigh immortality in Sacae, and he can actually kill the Pegasus Knights in Ilia as well as not die at all. His major problems are Mov and Spd, and Percival will give him Evd and even give him Hit so he can use the stronger weapons better. Cecilia has a mount and can keep with Percival. Percival can look forward to supports in some fashion, since the likeliness of Douglas, Ceclia, and Klein not being fielded all at the same time is very low. And, even then, he's got the bard/dancer to look forward to as well.
Swap Clarine for Roy, and you're correct. Removing Lance also has the benefits of more earlygame EXP for Alan, Dieck, Rutger, Roy, etc. Removing Percival has the cost of needing more money and EXP for your team overall. There is no benefit to removing Percival since, even if he's fielded, Elphin and Lalum are easily available to the offensive units with less mobility anyways. It's more than just Funds. Percival offers ridiculously high stats and awesome mobility for nothing. No promotion item was put into him and no EXP was necessary for this. I suggest you try and argue some combat performance next, and argue for Lance's earlygame utility and super high offense. |
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12:55 AM Nov 29
